Nicotine And Back Pain.

[DAYVAPE]

So, I've been doing some research since being diagnosed with "degenerative disc disease"... and am sad to find this little bit of information.

- Smoking Tobacco

Among the many harmful effects of cigarette smoking on the body, early and more severe degeneration of the back is getting more and more attention. Nicotine—in any form—blocks the transport of oxygen and important nutrients to the spine's discs. Starved of oxygen, the discs are much less able to repair themselves and tend to collapse at a much earlier age than is seen in non-smokers. This painful collapse—degenerative disc disease—can lead to chronic back pain. Moreover, should any surgery be needed, smokers have been found to have much slower healing times and a high rate of failure to heal.

You see, I live with chronic pain every single day in my L5/S1 region (low back). The doctors are telling me that the only fix is to have surgery and install a metal cage between the two bad discs and fuse them together. The two surgeons I've talked to also both asked me if I smoked... saying I needed to stop that for sure.

Not only do I not want to have some doctor jacking with my SPINE... I also don't want to cut nicotine from my diet. I like nicotine! I don't drink caffeine... and now I need to stop this too? It just isn't cool. But, I guess if I want to heal after surgery, I don't really have a choice. They actually said I need to be NIC FREE for at least 2 weeks prior to, and after surgery, if I want the best odds of healing properly, etc.

Anyone with any back surgery stories that will make me think I should have this done? I'm looking for some positive/uplifting stories!!

[Kragax]

Had it done 30 years ago, back then I even smoked in my hospital room. Healed just fine.

[snubber]

Sorry about the pain...have it too, know how it is.

I'm not saying it's not true, but it seems to me that alot of todays ailments that they can't put a finger on they lump in with smoking.

Yes it's bad for us that's why we try to quit. And many of us that have smoked for sooo many years have things wrong that are linked to our bad judgement. I'm just wondering how many things that give this same answer to just because they're not sure.

After all if they really knew what they were doing they wouldn't call it "practicing"

[DAYVAPE]

I hear you there Snubber!! Hell, I can give educated guesses as to what and why!! I don't know... there have just been alot more recent studies suggesting that the lack of blood flow, etc. to the affected areas will slow healing considerably. A couple of cases that I read about the doc seriously wouldn't do a certain procedure on someones back if they smoked! That's crazy man.... I just don't know. All I know is it's been a long 5 years trying EVERY other "treatment" under the sun! Injections didn't do jack for me AT ALL. What a total waste... and of course they wanted me to get "a series of two or three shots"....AT $500+ EA! What a crock!

Edited September 3, 2010 by DAYVAPE

[kitsune]

For the most part I do think they try to blame way too much on smoking......

However, this time I do think nicotine does affect the blood flow to the bones and really can delay healing. the blood supply to the bones is not like the blood supply to our heart or muscles. The bones are more sensitive to decreases in circulation--and it has been proven that nicotine affects circulation.

our spine surgeons don't even like to use nicotine patches, gum etc on their patients.

I am a spine nurse and see the good and the bad. Sometimes spine surgery is the only way to help chronic pain, when everything else has failed. If you follow all the directions before and after surgery you will have a great outcome.

One hint--the less pain medication you take a couple weeks before surgery--the better the pain medication works after surgery.

One of the advantages to vaping vs smoking--you can wean yourself to 0 nic and still be able to vape !!!

[DAYVAPE]

Great point Kits... cuz I have to eat quite a few Percs a day as it is. I don't wish this on anyone. I know what I'm going to have to do... I just keep reading crap about poor success rates and other horror stories! I need to just do it and hope for the best... it can't be any worse than I feel on a day to day basis now!

[kitsune]

first thing is to stop reading the horror stories. There are many, many reasons for spine failure or success. you just need to focus on those things that will make you a success.

Pain control is usually our hardest problem with spine patients due to the large volumes of pain meds they take daily-- by cutting that back (if you can) it will help after surgery. I see way more success with spine surgery than failure.

Those with a positive attitude definitely seem to get better faster.

The first thing I tell all my patients when they wake up--- Its going to hurt like a B**** to move, but moving is the only way you will get out of here. The more you move the quicker the pain gets better.

You will do great !!!

Time to start experimenting with some 0 nic flavors !!!

[DAYVAPE]

I'm sure happy to hear that most are a success!! Thanks!

How long prior to surgery should I have "cut back" on meds?? Like months?? Ack!

Edited September 3, 2010 by DAYVAPE

[owutaqt]

Have you talked to your doctor specifically about vaping? Have you told them that you quit smoking and what the whole story is?

I know that it is optimal to not have anything...........but I am wondering if you told your doctors and what they said?

I had knee surgery when I still smoked and they fused two bones together because my knee cap kept coming out of place...I healed fine, but my doctor did warn me it may be slower than a non smoker.

If you cannot do zero nicotine, I think if you can get lower even that would help.

Cheer up at least they seem to have an idea of what they can do to make it better.

[DAYVAPE]

I actually started vaping since my different doctor's appointments with the surgeons, etc. So, I didn't get to talk to them about it... would have liked to though. I'm definately going to start lowering my nic a bit at a time and see how I do. I sure never would have guessed I would be having a back surgery in my mid 30's!!! What worries me is that alot of times people end up needing multiple operations once you start down that path. At least that's what I've been told by a doctor.

Edited September 3, 2010 by DAYVAPE

[kitsune]

Unfortunately some people do need more than one surgery. back problems are difficult to treat at best. but you figure, you wouldn't be looking at this path if it wasn't already that bad !!

by being diligent with you back precautions you can slow the chances of needing more surgery. BLT--Bending, Lifting, Twisting. Low impact exercise--swimming, walking helps too.

Compliance with therapy and recovery is one of the main reasons spine surgeries fail or need to be repeated. Learn as much as you can about the recovery and tricks you can use (avoid the horror stories like the plague).

as far as the nicotine goes--I know all of our spine surgeons are adamant about no nicotine to help with recovery. As a nurse I can actually support this. The pathophysiology of bones supports this. the circulation to the bones is very, very sensitive--the bones don't use a lot of blood, so what blood they do get is very important.

Blaming every disease or problem on smoking or nicotine pisses me off--but occasionally, it may not be the cause, but it certainly doesn't help.

I haven't tried lower my nic yet--but I do find that using a bit of menthol in my flavors adds to the throat hit--this may help with lower the nic. FT Joe and Nana both use 0 nic and may be able to help with this.

YOU CAN DO THIS !!!!!!

[JRVapes]

Probably off topic but Kitsune you sound like a great nurse!

[kitsune]

Thank You. part cheerleader !!! and part Hard A**. Back problems are the worst.

That and my son has scoliosis--makes me more sympathetic

[Uma]

Sorry to hear about your back pain and the pain of going nic free before you're ready to. Kitsune offered excellent advice that I certainly can't add to. (so sorry about your son's problems too Kit).

My hubby's brother, in his 60's, recently had his back fixed and he's doing great! (same degenerative problem). He also has it in his knees and hips and when one surgery is over, he's in for another. He wishes now that he wouldn't have waited so long for the procedures to begin. He doesn't smoke, however he was a 2nd hand smoker for most of his life. (wife, father, brother, in-laws, friends, son... everyone smoked around him). According to Doyle, he should be worse off than a smoker. I'm surprised any of us are alive, to be honest... because we were all breathing 2nd hand smoke, plus smoking, and we all should have keeled over at age 20 if we go by the "official" reports. Hopefully they are exaggerating the nicotine report as well, but I wouldn't take a chance on it. Kit offered good advice, and I hope and pray it works swell for you. Best of luck to you. Can't wait to see pics of you in your new fangled Ninja Turtle outfit.

[mcquinn]

I just toughed mine out for quite a few years and the nerves finally scarred over ,now the pain is gone except when I really do something stupid.The outside of my right foot is numb but most people I know with the fused discs cannot do as much as I can .Now my arms are starting to tingle and have phantom pain from the nerves in my spine getting rubbed.It sucks getting old.I don't think you will miss the nic as much as you think you will.Niquid does not seem to be as addictive as smoking.I do like the pacifier effect of vaping though.

Edited September 4, 2010 by mcquinn