Electronic Cigarette Sales Banned In New York

[SickDripzz]

"HELL WILL OPEN IT"S DOORS AND SWALLOW THEM UP BEFORE THEY CAN TAKE THIS AWAY FROM ME!!!!"

I like this one.

And I agree with it too.

[Snik]

What is all that stuff about antifreeze, and unknown quantities of carcinogens that lady was talking about? Where did she get that from?

What we really need is definitive study(s) by a lab or labs on various e-cigs and juices that shows what is being inhaled. The only one I know of is one from New Zealand.

New Zealand Study

But it was only specific to one brand.

Frankly, I've often wondered about what is in the juices also. After all, they do come from China. Not exactly a country that instills confidence in it's quality control.

Edited: I am sure she got her info from this FDA Warning and this FDA analysis summary Actual analysis is Here

Still, we need some good ammunition on our side far beyond what we have now.

Edited April 26, 2010 by Snik

[Snik]

Anybody know nything about this?

From Wikipedia article here

"However, as of March 2010, a US Court of Appeals reinstated the FDA's authority to stop e-cigarettes from entering the country. The agency said in its appeal that it has regulated nicotine products, including nicotine patches, for years under the drug and device provisions of the Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act (FDCA). The agency argued that tobacco legislation enacted last year "expressly excludes from the definition of 'tobacco product' any article that is a drug, device or combination product under the FDCA, and provides that such articles shall be subject to regulation under the pre-existing FDCA provisions."[37]"

It sounds like the FDA got what they wanted. Are we all out of luck now?

[Kmel]

Anybody know nything about this?

From Wikipedia article here

"However, as of March 2010, a US Court of Appeals reinstated the FDA's authority to stop e-cigarettes from entering the country....

It sounds like the FDA got what they wanted. Are we all out of luck now?

Here's a couple of articles. The second one mentions the FDA Ban:

Electronic Cigarette Bans Seriously Questioned By The Public

State hopes to snuff out e-cigarette sales

[arcangel742]

OMG,

I am shocked! I cannot stand how corrupt these people are here in N.Y., more so than any other State, and to base it on lies, not uncommon for N.Y. They want us to pay their ridiculous taxes. What snakes!

We need to give them a taste of their own medicine.

As far as I can tell, the U.S. Court of Appeals reinstated the FDA authority merely to stop entering the Country March 2010.

Here is one main dispute about how to regulate them:

They cannot decide if they should be regulated as tobacco products, rather than drug or medical devices. Also the original case has NOT been exhausted from the lower Courts to the higher Courts over jurisdiction of the product.

Please remember there is still time to fight this by directly calling or faxing your elected officials and to tell them how this device has helped you and to dispute them and what they claim are facts.

This Bill still needs to pass the Senate and subsequently within a matter of so many days depending on the votes to be signed by the governor to become an active Law on the Books.

See:

HOW A BILL BECOMES A LAW IN New York STATE

http://www.bcnys.org.../sb/billlaw.htm

"Many believe that the FDA was reluctant to take legal action as long as its jurisdiction over the product was being challenged in court, and especially after a lower court judge questioned the agency's authority. However, now that the Court of Appeals has issued an order reaffirming the agency's power over e-cigarettes -- at least until the current case in the higher court is concluded -- the agency may feel that they have to be more aggressive and crack down on the growing market."

http://en.wikipedia....ronic_cigarette

January 2010

In January 2010, federal judge Richard J. Leon ordered the FDA to stop blocking the importation of electronic cigarettes from China, and indicated that the devices should be regulated as tobacco products, rather than drug or medical devices: "[...] With the passage of landmark tobacco legislation last year, the FDA's new tobacco division will be able to regulate the contents and marketing claims of e-cigarettes, in the same way it is about to begin regulating traditional tobacco products. But the agency's drug division cannot ban the devices [...]". Richards mentioned in his reasoning that e-cigarettes were not marketed as medical devices to help smokers quit, as FDA had argued, but rather as safer substitutes to give users the "nicotine hit that smokers crave".^[35] In February 2010, the FDA began an appeal of the ruling in a federal appeals court in Washington.^[36]

March 2010

However, as of March 2010, a US Court of Appeals reinstated the FDA's authority to stop e-cigarettes from entering the country. The agency said in its appeal that it has regulated nicotine products, including nicotine patches, for years under the drug and device provisions of the Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act (FDCA). The agency argued that tobacco legislation enacted last year "expressly excludes from the definition of 'tobacco product' any article that is a drug, device or combination product under the FDCA, and provides that such articles shall be subject to regulation under the pre-existing FDCA provisions."^[37]

It was then up to states until the FDA regulated what these devices were at the Federal Level to take their own action as did California. It was only going to be time before other states make their own interpretation, or demands and control as far as I see things, while other areas are still disputing it. The only reason I believe the FDA's first attempt to control it was faltered and was appealed was because of a Law Suit by an ecig company here in the U.S. and the various agencies attempts to define these devices and which agency will control them did not seem to agree.

You can read about the lawsuit here and interestingly why they cannot ban cigarettes as the Attorneys argued here link below, but can ban these!

http://legaltimes.ty...e-embargo-.html

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

• "In California, Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger vetoed a bill that would have banned sales, stating "[...] If adults want to purchase and consume these products with an understanding of the associated health risks, they should be able to do so [...]"^[38].

• In New Jersey, legislators have started work on a proposal to ban the use of electronic cigarettes in all "no smoking areas" of the state.^[39]

Please remember there is still time to fight this by directly calling or faxing your elected officials and to tell them how this device has helped you and to dispute them and what they claim are facts.

This Bill still needs to pass the Senate and subsequently within a matter of so many days depending on the votes to be signed by the governor to become an active Law on the Books.

See:

HOW A BILL BECOMES A LAW IN NEW YORK STATE

http://www.bcnys.org.../sb/billlaw.htm

Possible Debate Issues to Bring up with Facts:

You may want to dispute that the various assemblymen that voiced their opinions that led to such votes against it taped on the Video Evidence were NOT BASED on any real conclusive facts and that they by rendering us to the alternatives will be causing all much more harm than good. I would suggest that they do their homework next time and I would counterclaim to them that the chemical they claim is in antifreeze is in fact approved by the FDA as a food additive and in fact already in many of our foods.

Ironically the Honorable Titonce did not even name the chemical he was speaking of that he believed to be found in antifreeze and ecig devices. Here is what I found. I either buy ejuice in made with PG and VG, along with distilled water possibly some may have nicotine in it and maybe some sort of tobacco flavoring, and or candy flavors. I believe a sort of tobacco essence and flavorings are used. If there are any others than it is not to my knowledge. I currently am even making some of my own ejuice out of the same ingredients mentioned minus the tobacco flavor and nicotine. I would like to hear from those who actually make and sell the ejuice to properly be able to dispute their claims, if there are any from the U.S. here. But here is the info on the two main possibly 3 ingredients I know of aside from Nicotine.

There was some argument that Diethylene glycol was found in only some of the cartridges, by only two venders. While this may be the case, and Diethylene glycol is listed as a dangerous substance, we need to dispute that it is common to these devices or the eliquids we buy for them or use.

http://en.wikipedia....ethylene_glycol

One possible tobacco essence:

3-hydroxy-2-methyl-4-pyrone

http://www.chemicalb...N_CB5768714.htm

PG: propylene glycol

http://en.wikipedia....ropylene_glycol

Quoted from therein:

Applications

Propylene glycol is used:

• As a solvent in many pharmaceuticals, including oral, injectable and topical formulations. Notably, diazepam, which is insoluble in water, uses propylene glycol as its solvent in its clinical, injectable form.^[5]

• As a humectant food additive, labeled as E number E1520

• As an emulsification agent in Angostura and orange bitters
• As a moisturizer in medicines, cosmetics, food, toothpaste, mouth wash, and tobacco products
• As a carrier in fragrance oils
• As an ingredient in massage oils
• In hand sanitizers, antibacterial lotions, and saline solutions
• In smoke machines to make artificial smoke for use in firefighters' training and theatrical productions
• In electronic cigarettes, it is used to deliver vaporized nicotine
• As a solvent for food colors and flavorings
• As an ingredient, along with wax and gelatin, in the production of paintballs
• As a moisture stabilizer (humectant) for snus (Swedish style snuff).
• As a cooling agent for beer and wine glycol jacketed fermentation tanks
• As a non-toxic antifreeze for winterizing drinking water systems, and in applications where the used antifreeze eventually will be drained into the soil, water, or a septic system.^[6]
• As a less-toxic antifreeze in solar water heating systems
• As a solvent used in mixing photographic chemicals, such as film developers
• In cryonics
• As a working fluid in hydraulic presses
• As a coolant in liquid cooling systems
• To regulate humidity in a cigar humidor
• As the killing and preserving agent in pitfall traps, usually used to capture ground beetles
• As an additive to pipe tobacco to prevent dehydration.
• To treat livestock ketosis
• As the main ingredient in deodorant sticks.
• To de-ice aircraft.^[7]
• As an ingredient in UV or blacklight tattoo ink

Propylene glycol has properties similar to those of ethylene glycol (monoethylene glycol, or MEG). (Note: Infrequently propylene glycol may also use the acronym MEG, but as an abbreviation of methyl ethyl glycol- the industry standard acronym for propylene glycol is PG or MPG (monopropylene glycol)). The industrial norm is to replace ethylene glycol with propylene glycol when safer properties are desired.

VG-Vegetable Glycerin

Pleased keep in mind, these ingredients may not even be Pure USP food grade VG, as on this website

with contents listed.

http://www.morethana...etable-Glycerin

http://www.botanical...-glycerine.html

Specifications

Color- Clear

Odor/Taste- Flat aroma, very sweet flavor resembling syrup.

Glycerol content- 99.8%

Fatty Acids and Esters- 0.3

Specific Gravity- 1.29

pH- 7

Heavy Metals - <5 pap

Chlorides- <10 pap

Chlorinated compounds- <30 pap

Sulphates- <20 ppm

Moisture- 0.13%

Organic Volatile Impurities- None detected

Diethylene Glycol and related compounds- No trace amounts detected

Quoted from link below"

American Association of Public Health Physicians

The voice of public health physicians, guardians of the public's health

Tobacco Control Task Force

Fax

March 27, 2009

To: Senator Lautenberg

Fax: 202 228 4054

Subject: Please Cancel Opposition to Electronic Cigarettes

Research to date has clearly demonstrated that smokers smoke because they

are addicted to nicotine. This same research also shows that the illness

and death due to cigarettes is not due to the nicotine, but due to products

of combustion and, to a lesser degree, toxins in the cigarette tobacco.

Read more: http://www.ecigarett...l#ixzz0mGgGIKhc

American Association of Public Health Physicians writes on behalf of Electronic Cigarettes to the Incoming Director of the FDA

"Anyone can easily see what's happening here. Big tobacco is using lobbying techniques, and is trying to use their power to manipulate our governments assembly and senate to doing their dirty work and stopping any competition in the industry. Hopefully democracy proves to be stronger then capitalism in this matter because there is 4,000,000 of 8,000,000 smokers whose lives will be saved in the next 20 years because of the electronic cigarette, according to a letter written to the FDA from the American Association of Public Health Physicians."

FDA from the American Association of Public Health Physicians Writing on behalf of electronic cigarette users SEE LINK BELOW:

http://www.e-cig.org...tor-of-the-fda/

Please tell them next time to get their facts straight. As far as the Honorable Titonce's story about a child being able to get these devices over the Internet that carries nicotine, please ask him what child he has given a creditcard to in order to buy such a thing, and what parent is not watching what their kids on doing online, as well as to show us just one ecig website that does not ask if you under or over 18 before entering?

If they are so worried about children on the Internet than maybe they should do something about porn websites or either stop watching porn themselves on our dime instead of doing any real labor, while trying to control what we do as adults.

We are not going to pay for their outright hypocritical views and actions any more while they pick our pockets. We have woken up to their thievery of our pockets as well as any types of ingenuity that save us from their taxes, their control and the various CORPS PAYING THEM to enact laws to KILL us, as well as and their attempts to make some logic out of the ridiculous.

Example, if they are really so worried about our health, and we are in fact buying these devices because not only are they safer, and cheaper, but save ourselves from the thousands of carcinogens deliberately put into tobacco products, then why do they allow us to eat food that contains aspertain proven to shut down all of our organs and cause Cancer, beef with hormones that effect our biology in negative ways, or Monsanto with bioengineered seeds and grains with effects altering our very genes in such a way that we will never be able to reverse any adverse effects and all kinds of additives that are killing us! When should we ever trust such arrogant, corrupt and greedy people ever again to control our health much less their attempts to look or act sane anymore! (THIS PART, JUST MY ANGRY RANT, LOL!)

PLEASE DO NOT FORGET TO MENTION ALL THE FIRES THAT OCCUR AS A RESULT OF CIGARETTES AND LOSS OF LIFE AND HOW THESE DEVICES WILL PHYSICALLY SAVE LIVES AND PROPERTY UNLESS THEY FORCE US BACK TO CIGARETTES.

ALSO MENTION THAT CIGARETTES HAVE OVER 4,000 chemical agents, including over 60 carcinogens AND 599 additives that are very dangerous and approved by the US Government for use in the manufacture of cigarettes is something every smoker should see, yet it is illegal to ban them!

http://www.tricounty...ngredients.html

http://quitsmoking.a...ingredients.htm

http://whyquit.com/w...o_Additives.htm

EDIT - I just received this information from Kristin over at CASAA.org.

Please visit http://vaperscoalition.org/

About halfway down is a link for emailing the Senators in New York. Be sure to click the Senate link and not the Assembly link! This will open an email form in your email system, automatically filled with the Senator's email addresses and a form letter. Please tell people to be sure to sign it.

We recommend that New York residents use the form letter, but write by snail mail, fax or call, because email is often ignored! Adding a story about your e-cig success is a nice touch.

Also, the New York Senate has an "Open Legislation" website where you can comment on Bills in progress.

The page for S7234 (the one that will result in a de facto ban in NY State) is here: http://open.nysenate...tion/bill/S7234

Kristin Noll Marsh

CASAA.org

****

Well it looks like New York is done. Electronic cigarette sales are now banned in New York. Here is the video

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=Yc2iMn7EZ5Q

EDIT: Here is a link to the bill: Click Here

CALL LOCAL REP and SENATOR

If you are an NY resident call your local representative for bill A9529 and call your Senator for bill S7234, if you do not know this information please click the following links

REPRESENTATIVES click here

SENATORS click here

The members listed below are sponsoring these bills. EVERONE SHOULD CALL THESE OFFICES TO PROTECT OUR RIGHTS!

Jeffery D. Klien (Senator)

(800) 718-2039

(718) 822-2049

Linda B. Rosenthal (Assembly Member)

(212) 873-6368

GOVERNOR OFFICE

518-474-8390

[Hudsonkm]

As I mentioned in my last post:

We were able to defeat the bill in Illinois and New Yorkers can do the same. In our case the bill made it through the Senate and on to the House. Illinois E-Cigarette users attended the hearings and the state actually listened to their stories and discussions of the positive experiences they have had with the product.

The following day we found that the Chair of the Human Services Committee REMOVED her name as a sponsor of the bill due to what was said at the hearing.

It was also determined that most of the info they had which led to the attempted ban was from the American Lung Association.

As in New York, Illinois cigarette taxes are insane. Likewise, I have to admit that I was indeed worried that we didn't have much chance to defeat the bill for that reason alone.

I was proven wrong thankfully, and our bill as of last week went 19(a) and was sent back to the rules committee. It can be re-introduced in a future session but for the time being we are keeping our fingers crossed.

Edited April 27, 2010 by Hudsonkm

[arcangel742]

Hi Hudsonkm,

I saw that post. Thank so much for it, it is encouraging and very knowledgeable. I admit many of us in N.Y. are in a panic. I forgot to look up what the American Lung Association had to say so I can dispute that too.

Thanks sooooooooo much!

As I mentioned in my last post:

We were able to defeat the bill in Illinois and New Yorkers can do the same. In our case the bill made it through the Senate and on to the House. Illinois E-Cigarette users attended the hearings and the state actually listened to their stories and discussions of the positive experiences they have had with the product.

The following day we found that the Chair of the Human Services Committee REMOVED her name as a sponsor of the bill due to what was said at the hearing.

It was also determined that most of the info they had which led to the attempted ban was from the American Lung Association.

As in New York, Illinois cigarette taxes are insane. Likewise, I have to admit that I was indeed worried that we didn't have much chance to defeat the bill for that reason alone.

I was proven wrong thankfully, and our bill as of last week went 19(a) and was sent back to the rules committee. It can be re-introduced in a future session but for the time being we are keeping our fingers crossed.

[FTJoe]

125-0? Are you kidding me?

NYS is in huge trouble financially. They force Amazon to have folks pay sales tax, they want the soda tax, they are in desperate need of money. Losing the tax on cigarettes is I'm sure whats behind this.

[arcangel742]

Hi All,

I wasted so much time trying to go back and do all the research I had done three months ago before I even started vaping, just to have the facts to put together a decent letter and email to send to all possible Reps here in N.Y. Then I had to waste more time trying to find their real email addresses, and not the limiting web forms I found along with all the Senate fax numbers.

I had gone to the link Christopher put up for the vaperscoalition, but because I was not a member, I did not follow up with the links on the bottom of their page. The links said" if you are a member", so I passed them by especially when I could not find out how to become one. I came back later after wasting 3 days doing more research.

Long story short I am believing Kristin won't mind if I put these direct links here. She already did all the work I was still trying to do on my own. If you go to these links she has a pre-made letter/email for you to send with all the email addresses. You can just send one email to all by putting the email addresses into either C.C. or B.C.C. This would just take you a few seconds of your time to do and help us in N.Y. as well hopefully in your subsequent States.

I have also found some other information posted in other places that I will include in a later posting. I did just email the Vapor Coalition.

PLEASE REMEMBER TO TYPE IN YOUR NAME ON THE BOTTOM OF HER EMAIL/LETTER IF YOU WOULD BE KIND ENOUGH TO SEND IT.

Thank You, and God Bless us All!

http://vaperscoalition.org/NVC.html

http://vaperscoalition.org/CASAA.html

Christopher, is there a way to email all who posted on this topic to please use these links for a pre-made email to send to the N.Y. Senators, to encourage them to do so if they have not already? Thanks!

OR ANYONE WHO STILL WANTS TO HELP CAN USE THIS INFORMATION BELOW:

To contact the New York Senate

Copy the following email addresses and paste them in the “To:” section of your email.

duane@senate.state.ny.us, farley@senate.state.ny.us, fuschill@senate.state.ny.us, hannon@senate.state.ny.us, johnson@senate.state.ny.us, jdklein@senate.state.ny.us, kruger@senate.state.ny.us , larkin@senate.state.ny.us, little@senate.state.ny.us, montgome@senate.state.ny.us, saland@senate.state.ny.us, sampson@senate.state.ny.us, scousins@senate.state.ny.us, athompso@senate.state.ny.us, valesky@senate.state.ny.us, winner@senate.state.ny.us, cyoung@senate.state.ny.us

Copy the following and paste it into the “Subject:” line of your email…

OPPOSE S7234: Electronic Cigarettes/ Nicotine Vaporizers

Then copy the following and paste it into the body on your email and then sign your name …

Senator,

After many years of smoking, I now use an electronic cigarette/nicotine vaporizer instead of smoking. I have heard that S7234 would ban the sale of electronic cigarettes/nicotine vaporizers completely and that I would no longer be able to purchase them in New York State. I am sure that as one of your constituents, you do not want me to start smoking tobacco cigarettes again, but this will be the unintended consequence of the proposed bill.

These devices are the one thing that finally helped me stop smoking after trying so many other ways. Tobacco cigarettes deliver many dangerous chemicals, but electronic cigarettes deliver nicotine without those dangerous chemicals. I can breathe better and I feel better. I don’t cough and I don’t smell awful anymore.

I know that you have been told that they contain many dangerous chemicals, but this is not true. I would please ask you to get more information on the device and to educate yourself before voting on this bill. I am a member of the National Vapers Club and they have a short 8 minute video and a webpage that we can send to our legislators so that they may educate themselves. Here is a link.

http://www.vapetube....onic-cigarettes

http://vapersclub.co...turepacket.html

We hope that you will take the time to educate yourself so that you can help protect the health of your constituents who use this device instead of smoking tobacco cigarettes.

Thank you for your time.

(REPLACE WITH YOUR NAME)

_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Edited April 28, 2010 by arcangel742

[arcangel742]

The correct Albany addresses for NY Senate Health Committee members are below

Calls, snail mails, faxes, and e-mails are all helpful. And if you already sent letters (via e-mail, snail mail or fax), follow it up with a call.

Please write/fax/calll NY Senate Health Committee members:

Thomas K. Duane, Chair

430 Capitol Building

Albany, NY 12247

518-455-2451

Fax 518-426-6846

duane@senate.state.ny.us

Hugh T. Farley

706 Legislative Office Building

Albany, NY 12247

518-455-2181

Fax (518) 455-2271

farley@senate.state.ny.us

Charles J. Fuschillo, Jr.

615 Legislative Office Building

Albany, New York 12247

518-455-3341

Fax 518-426-6823

fuschill@senate.state.ny.us

Kemp Hannon

408 Legislative Office Building

Albany, NY 12247

518-455-2200

Fax 518-426-6954

hannon@senate.state.ny.us

Craig M. Johnson

814 Legislative Office Building

Albany, NY 12247

518-455-2622

Fax 518-426-6894

johnson@senate.state.ny.us

Jeffrey D. Klein (bill sponsor)

427 Capitol Building

Albany, New York 12247

518-455-3595

Fax 518-426-6887

jdklein@senate.state.ny.us

Carl Kruger

913 Legislative Office Building

Albany, New York 12247

518-455-2460

Fax 518-426-6855

kruger@senate.state.ny.us

William J. Larkin, Jr.

406 Legislative Office Building

Albany, NY 12247

518-455-2770

Fax 518-426-6923

larkin@senate.state.ny.us

Betty Little

506 Legislative Office Building

Albany, NY 12247

518-455-2811

Fax 518-426-6873

little@senate.state.ny.us

Velmanette Montgomery

711 Legislative Office Building

Albany, NY 12247

518-455-3451

Fax 518-426-6854

montgome@senate.state.ny.us

Stephen M. Saland

617 Legislative Office Building

Albany, New York 12247

518-455-2411

Fax 518-426-6920

saland@senate.state.ny.us

John L. Sampson

409 Legislative Office Building

Albany, NY 12247

518-455-2788

Fax 518-426-6806

sampson@senate.state.ny.us

Andrea Stewart-Cousins

805 Legislative Office Building

Albany, NY 12247

518-455-2585

Fax 518-426-6811

scousins@senate.state.ny.us

Antoine M. Thompson

902 Legislative Office Building

Albany, New York 12247

518-455-3371

Fax 518-426-6969

athompso@senate.state.ny.us

David J. Valesky

416 State Capitol Building

Albany, New York 12247

518-455-2838

Fax 518-426-6885

valesky@senate.state.ny.us

George Winner

415 Legislative Office Building

Albany, NY 12247

518-455-2091

Fax 518-426-6976

winner@senate.state.ny.us

Catherine Young

513 Legislative Office Building

Albany, New York 12247

518-455-3563

Fax 518-426-6905

cyoung@senate.state.ny.us 04-26-2010, 10:49 PM

Edited April 28, 2010 by arcangel742

[arcangel742]

Hi Chris,

I wasted much time doing research so I could put together a decent letter/email to send reps in NY. I went to Kristin's link you had put for the collation, but because it said, "if you are a member click this link", I failed to see she already had a pre-made letter and all the real email addresses for N.Y. Senate, not being a member or any link to sign up. She did make it easy to send one email to all Senators in N.Y., that I did not see until much later.

I tried to email her to ask some questions, never heard back. I tried to post on the forum on the subject you started for NY ban, the email and address for people to use with Kristins pre-made email, but I now don't see anyone answering the call.

I feel like I am fighting all by myself. Am I missing something? Where is this Coalition , or the people concerned? Is there any way to direct people to this quick email to send if they would like to help?

http://www.vaportalk...rk/page__st__56

Thanks,

Judith

Reply from Christopher:

Sent Today, 05:21 PM

Well if you posted that, everyone in the thread will get an auto email update. It can be hard to get people to fight. It's something we deal with all the time, most people don't want to fight until it's to late. (lazy)

It looks like you have some awesome links and I hope everyone sends the emails out but whether or not they will I cannot say. I would suggest saying the same thing you've said to me here in PM on the forum. Let them know this isn't a joke. At this rate it's very likely the ban will go into effect. Did you know Vapor Talk also has a store? Visit our Store! Starter Kits, VT E Liquid and more!

Then may we meet upon the level and part upon the square...

Edited April 29, 2010 by arcangel742

[missxenobia]

I haven't been around much but I sent out your letter and I will call them tomorrow! Hopefully more have sent this out!

Edited May 2, 2010 by missxenobia

[arcangel742]

Hi There missxenobia,

Thank you so much for doing this. Ironically, I had not been around myself for a couple of months after being ill. I no sooner came back on the forum and it happened. I had no idea they were even voting on it. I started vaping a few months ago, going on four now and only had time to get a few basic things. I thought I had time. I feel like a deer caught in the headlights.

I haven't been around much but I sent out your letter and I will call them tomorrow! Hopefully more have sent this out!

Edited May 2, 2010 by arcangel742