Food For Thought Or Fuel For The Fire

[mcquinn]

The studies that show vaping to be harmless were as far as I know done by Ruyan ,they used Ruyan liquid in a Ruyan cartridge on a Ruyan battery and vaped at a rate where they conclude one cartridge is equal to one pack of analogs.If you translate this to how I vape I suppose I am vaping equivalent to at least two or three packs of analogs a day.I don’t know what strength of liquid they used to reach their conclusions ,I am sure it wasn’t 36 mg.

The reason I am starting this thread is to get us thinking about our habits .I wonder what the scientists at Ruyan would think of how the average person really uses these things?

For the record my two or three packs a day are with no nic for the most part.

What do you folks think?

[NeRo9k]

Well it's safe to say that one cartridge doesn't equal a package of cigarettes and I believe it's also been concluded that that every draw from an electronic cigarette equals 1/3-2/3 the amount of nicotine you would get from the same drag on an analog.

[Steve32]

If its zero nicotine how can it be equivalent to an analog

[Brandon]

Good info and good point McQuinn. Honestly considering the controversy right now, we really should be taking a 'devils advocate' approach to some things.

I honestly have no idea how many mils of juice I'm vaping per day, b/c I really switch around soooooo dang much. But I'll gaurantee it's a heck of a lot more than what I smoked in my analog days. Granted, some of that is zero nic juice (I only have a few). But all of my main juice is 11mg. So am I getting more nicotine than when I was smoking? I'd be stupid to say no.

Do I think vaping is harmless? Heck no. Do I think it's healthier than smoking? Heck yes. Vaping is a vice, and there's no point in thinking otherwise or trying to market it as anything but a healthier alternative. That's what I tell my friends and family, and for the most part, they're happy I've made the switch.

But you bring up a good point in that we should never think vaping is 100% harmless. I just can't believe that my health is the same as someone that doesn't vape. But for now I'm ok with that, and we'll see what the future brings.

Vaping is a hobby, a lifestyle, and a chemical addiction all rolled into one package. That's a big statement, but it satisfies the three major necessities of my personality

[VapOrDie]

I know that my body is taking in a lot more nic since I started vaping and I sort of did it on purpose to help with the switch. Now if I have an analog it doesn't quite cure my craving for nic. But my body feels sooooo much better without all the crap from analogs in my lungs. Honestly even if they found that vaping was somehow worse than smoking I'd still do it because I can breathe, taste and smell again. Back to the point, I don't think I vape more than I smoked but since it's a higher nicotine content compared to a smoke I'm getting more nicotine..... So how is smoking compared to vaping? Is it just from how many puffs one takes? Or is it the amount of nicotine in say a 10ml bottle of juice divided by the average amount in a pack of cigarettes? Because if that's the case than my 10ml bottle of 26mg juice lasts me about a week and (correct me if I'm wrong) A pack of Camel Wides is about 18mg that would last me a day. So then I'm vaping less nicotine overall? Which completely contradicts what I thought..... My head hurts

[PiWright]

The studies that show vaping to be harmless were as far as I know done by Ruyan ,they used Ruyan liquid in a Ruyan cartridge on a Ruyan battery and vaped at a rate where they conclude one cartridge is equal to one pack of analogs.If you translate this to how I vape I suppose I am vaping equivalent to at least two or three packs of analogs a day.I don't know what strength of liquid they used to reach their conclusions ,I am sure it wasn't 36 mg.

The reason I am starting this thread is to get us thinking about our habits .I wonder what the scientists at Ruyan would think of how the average person really uses these things?

For the record my two or three packs a day are with no nic for the most part.

What do you folks think?

It depends on the day I am having but on a busy day I vap about 1.5 Ml of 18mg, but on a lazy day I can vap about 4ml of 18mg just blowing vapor rings. There are variables though, in a cigarette most of the nicotine is burned off so you only get a fraction of the nicotine available at any given time. Any vaporizer on the other hand works at a much lower temperature than a analogue's cherry so you sould get more of the available nicotine in a comparable drag. Then there are device variables. A mini-cig has less volts to throw at it's atty so it should burn off less of the nicotine but takes longer to get to temperature so it gives a smaller overall hit, (at least my EVO sure does), where a 5v should burn off more nicotine despite it giving a bigger hit. Also there are the new variables like low resistance atties and HV atties and I have not had a chance to try either of those. This is all speculation on my part as I am no scientist. What would be interesting is if we could get one of the puffer machines they use to test nicotine concentrations per hit and rig it to test personal vaporizers. you sure have given me allot to think about though mcquinn.

[SickDripzz]

I know that my body is taking in a lot more nic since I started vaping and I sort of did it on purpose to help with the switch. Now if I have an analog it doesn't quite cure my craving for nic. But my body feels sooooo much better without all the crap from analogs in my lungs. Honestly even if they found that vaping was somehow worse than smoking I'd still do it because I can breathe, taste and smell again. Back to the point, I don't think I vape more than I smoked but since it's a higher nicotine content compared to a smoke I'm getting more nicotine..... So how is smoking compared to vaping? Is it just from how many puffs one takes? Or is it the amount of nicotine in say a 10ml bottle of juice divided by the average amount in a pack of cigarettes? Because if that's the case than my 10ml bottle of 26mg juice lasts me about a week and (correct me if I'm wrong) A pack of Camel Wides is about 18mg that would last me a day. So then I'm vaping less nicotine overall? Which completely contradicts what I thought..... My head hurts

The amount of nicotine(mg) in an eliquid bottle is measured per ml. For every one ml of eliquid, there is (x)mg of nicotine, 26mg in your case. Your 10ml bottle of 26mg nicotine contains 260mg of nicotine in total. Mathematically, you are consuming 37.14 mg/1.43ml of nicotine per day by vaping a 10ml bottle of 26mg eliquid per week. But not all of the nicotine is absorbed when vaping (no official studies have been made on this but it is said to be roughly 60-80%). But basically you have doubled your nicotine consumption.

Edited April 2, 2010 by SickDripzz

[VapOrDie]

The amount of nicotine(mg) in an eliquid bottle is measured per ml. For every one ml of eliquid, there is (x)mg of nicotine, 26mg in your case. Your 10ml bottle of 26mg nicotine contains 260mg of nicotine in total. Mathematically, you are consuming 37.14 mg/1.43ml of nicotine per day by vaping a 10ml bottle of 26mg eliquid per week. But not all of the nicotine is absorbed when vaping (no official studies have been made on this but it is said to be roughly 60-80%). But basically you have doubled your nicotine consumption.

And yet I'm still vaping less than I smoked... On average I'd say I take about 5-7 puffs on my PV per nic attack and a smoke is about 13-15 puffs. So if I take 6 puffs 20 times a day rather than 14 puffs 20 times a day then I'm inhaling considerably less crap into my lungs overall even though I'm getting more nicotine. Anyway I look at it I love to vape!

On a side note: Does anyone else find that the increase in nicotine helps them focus more? Or is that just me?

[FTJoe]

And yet I'm still vaping less than I smoked... On average I'd say I take about 5-7 puffs on my PV per nic attack and a smoke is about 13-15 puffs. So if I take 6 puffs 20 times a day rather than 14 puffs 20 times a day then I'm inhaling considerably less crap into my lungs overall even though I'm getting more nicotine. Anyway I look at it I love to vape!

On a side note: Does anyone else find that the increase in nicotine helps them focus more? Or is that just me?

I've always believed that most of my addiction to smoking was the pavlovian response. Feel stress, smoke. Think about that you can't smoke, stress, you want one. Brain has related smoking to getting that good nicotine but it doesn't actually know you're not getting it. My point is, I didn't wake up every hour to smoke.

When I started vaping it felt so right I went 0mg after a few weeks. Big mistake but it took about a day for the actual nicotine withdrawal to kick in. Wow - what a crabby guy (even for me). My brain was fat dumb and happy thinking it was getting the good stuff as I vaped 0mg. I believe it simply related one action to the other and was satisfied with the vaping. It actually takes a while for the withdrawal to really get going. That was my experience, other people and their addictions are different. So I slowly went to zero and then the urge to even vape drifted away. I still force myself because my STUPID brain is still looking for the hand to mouth (food). Though we discussed recently that maybe the lack of nic is slowing the metabolism down.

[SickDripzz]

And yet I'm still vaping less than I smoked... On average I'd say I take about 5-7 puffs on my PV per nic attack and a smoke is about 13-15 puffs. So if I take 6 puffs 20 times a day rather than 14 puffs 20 times a day then I'm inhaling considerably less crap into my lungs overall even though I'm getting more nicotine. Anyway I look at it I love to vape!

On a side note: Does anyone else find that the increase in nicotine helps them focus more? Or is that just me?

Nicotine definitely helps me focus, a couple days without it, I feel like a veggie.

[haft2doit]

I feel that since the switch to vaping i do take in far more "hits" of nicotine per day than with anologs. 1 i like the action of smoking. 2 i like (or rather my brain) likes the nicotine. 3 The taste of the diff flavors of liquid is delicious. 4 and the most important I feel healthier. I have come to the realization that the wall in my way of getting nicotine to my brain was the negative side of analogs. I only ever managed half a pack a day normally. With some added for the weekend bar smoking. The smell, health effects, and the general "crap feeling" stopped me from smoking more. While I still feel vaping is a great alternative, vaping should be taken seriously. Once I could get my nic without the things that made me hate my habit, slowly the more I have grown to like it. Nicotine is something i would love to live without. I think it now comes down to my ability to let it go. I know everyone has a diff experience. I love vaping, I think I would like not just as well. That said congrats to those who have switched vaping I feel has really helped people. Sry I was in a rambling mood.

[SickDripzz]

I feel that since the switch to vaping i do take in far more "hits" of nicotine per day than with anologs. 1 i like the action of smoking. 2 i like (or rather my brain) likes the nicotine. 3 The taste of the diff flavors of liquid is delicious. 4 and the most important I feel healthier. I have come to the realization that the wall in my way of getting nicotine to my brain was the negative side of analogs. I only ever managed half a pack a day normally. With some added for the weekend bar smoking. The smell, health effects, and the general "crap feeling" stopped me from smoking more. While I still feel vaping is a great alternative, vaping should be taken seriously. Once I could get my nic without the things that made me hate my habit, slowly the more I have grown to like it. Nicotine is something i would love to live without. I think it now comes down to my ability to let it go. I know everyone has a diff experience. I love vaping, I think I would like not just as well. That said congrats to those who have switched vaping I feel has really helped people. Sry I was in a rambling mood.

I couldn't agree with you more about your 4 stated points, especially the act of smoking. Even as a little kid loved "blowing smoke" when it was chilly outside, I'll never forget how much fun I had with that . I also managed to inhale only half a pack a day, too many analogs just made me feel like crap. At the same time I was a weekend smoker like you, but instead of the bars the casino was my place to be. Like a bar, it's cigarettes galore in there... to the point where it just doesn't feel right to not be smoking! lol

And don't ever feel like your rambling on, you established some great points of interest in there; if you ever read some of my posts you'll see I go on and on and on about some of the stuff I talk about! LOL

Edited April 3, 2010 by SickDripzz

[haft2doit]

I couldn't agree with you more about your 4 stated points, especially the act of smoking. Even as a little kid loved "blowing smoke" when it was chilly outside, I'll never forget how much fun I had with that . I also managed to inhale only half a pack a day, too many analogs just made me feel like crap. At the same time I was a weekend smoker like you, but instead of the bars the casino was my place to be. Like a bar, it's cigarettes galore in there... to the point where it just doesn't feel right to not be smoking! lol

And don't ever feel like your rambling on, you established some great points of interest in there; if you ever read some of my posts you'll see I go on and on and on about some of the stuff I talk about! LOL

Just read your post about nic poisoning. Sounds horrible. You did go on and on. any further problems?

[jiffy]

I don't believe that we get as much nicotine as we think from vaping. I only smoked 5-8 analogs per day. I switched to vaping and vape all day. I hardly put this thing down at all.

When I smoked analogs I had to have one every so often or go crazy. With the vaping I can go all day without really caring.

I think a placebo effect is what helps the most with vaping...the feeling of smoking.

[SickDripzz]

I don't believe that we get as much nicotine as we think from vaping. I only smoked 5-8 analogs per day. I switched to vaping and vape all day. I hardly put this thing down at all.

When I smoked analogs I had to have one every so often or go crazy. With the vaping I can go all day without really caring.

I think a placebo effect is what helps the most with vaping...the feeling of smoking.

Do the math and figure out if you really are getting more or less nicotine by vaping, I have provided a simple formula below. I'm curious to know why you think we get less nicotine from vaping than what we believe to be so. I do agree with you about the placebo effect, I believe that plays a big part in the success of people quitting smoking cigarettes to vaping. Also, a nicotine addiction is not the same as a general cigarette addiction, for one may find the need to smoke much greater than the need to vape.

Nicotine consumption formula:

Amount of liquid [ml] (x)

Amount of nicotine [mg] (y)

Total amount of nicotine in bottle (t)

Days it takes to consume fully (d)

x(y) = t

t/d = Amount of nicotine (mg) consumed per day.

x/d = Amount of liquid (ml) comsumed per day.

Roughly 60-80% of nicotine is absorbed by vaping.

[Brandon]

@FTJoe - this is off topic I suppose, but I would love to hear more of your venture into zero nic vaping. The challenges, the change in shopping for parts and juice, and just overall how you went about it. Perhaps in a different thread, or however you feel more comfortable.

Ultimately, that's my goal - to go zero nic. But I'm not rushing it. I'm trying to take my time so that I don't have any setbacks. So I'd love to hear your experiences and how you went about it (in as much detail as you can conveniently share).

Edited April 3, 2010 by Brandon

[FTJoe]

@FTJoe - this is off topic I suppose, but I would love to hear more of your venture into zero nic vaping. The challenges, the change in shopping for parts and juice, and just overall how you went about it. Perhaps in a different thread, or however you feel more comfortable.

Ultimately, that's my goal - to go zero nic. But I'm not rushing it. I'm trying to take my time so that I don't have any setbacks. So I'd love to hear your experiences and how you went about it (in as much detail as you can conveniently share).

Will do - doing some vanilla stoli tonight so it'll have to wait until morning. ;-) Probably post in the health, safety area. I want to gather past posts on nicotine in general, etc. have to go buy some cartos now...lol...I'm going to be in so much trouble.

[FTJoe]

Looks like mcquinn beat me to it. I'll still post but now I'll look like a copycat...lol

[jiffy]

Do the math and figure out if you really are getting more or less nicotine by vaping, I have provided a simple formula below. I'm curious to know why you think we get less nicotine from vaping than what we believe to be so. I do agree with you about the placebo effect, I believe that plays a big part in the success of people quitting smoking cigarettes to vaping. Also, a nicotine addiction is not the same as a general cigarette addiction, for one may find the need to smoke much greater than the need to vape.

Nicotine consumption formula:

Amount of liquid [ml] (x)

Amount of nicotine [mg] (y)

Total amount of nicotine in bottle (t)

Days it takes to consume fully (d)

x(y) = t

t/d = Amount of nicotine (mg) consumed per day.

x/d = Amount of liquid (ml) comsumed per day.

Roughly 60-80% of nicotine is absorbed by vaping.

The absorption rate of the nicotine is the big "what if" in my opinion. What studies have been conducted, scientifically showing the absorption rates of vaping?

We can't even get a solid scientific study clarifying whether vaping is bad for us or not.

Maybe nicotine isn't the biggest contributor of analog addiction. Like I said I was a light analog smoker, very light, but I vape all day long. My addiction to vaping is physically less, based on my cravings, than analogs ever were. I "had" to have analogs, but with vaping it isn't the same craving.

Edited April 4, 2010 by jiffy

[mcquinn]

I can pretty much gaurentee you are getting some nicotine.How much for sure I don't believe can be quantified ,too many variables .The formulas I think would be good for comparison.

[jiffy]

I can pretty much gaurentee you are getting some nicotine.How much for sure I don't believe can be quantified ,too many variables .The formulas I think would be good for comparison.

That is how I feel. There are many variables involved when you talk about how much nicotine is absorbed.

[mcquinn]

FTJoe I would like to hear your story ,cannot get enough of good news these days.