New regulations for ecigs

[mcVape]

Came across this article on new regulations on ecigs and restrictions on how they are manufactured. Does anyone have insight on this?

http://blog.rollingpapersexpress.com/rolling-paper-blog/tobacco-products-directive-and-what-it-means-for-you/

[Earthling789]

European Union directives mean nothing to the USA...  BUT, our politicians worship the "wonderful governance" of the European leaders, so I'm sure they'll buy into it and try to pass that crap here.  All of the regulations proposed are to limit choice and to hinder small businesses.  All of this is driven by Big Tobacco to limit choices to what they want you to have, so vaping will lose it's appeal and variety.  It's easy to sell Renault cars when they are the only ones available... and I chose that brand for a reason... because they are so poorly made, they don't pass US safety inspections and aren't allowed to be sold or imported in the US since the mid-80's?  Yep, those wonderful French can sure make a car... just like they can make decisions on their elected officials

[Christopher]

For those who don't wish to click the link. (This is fairly import because as pointed out, these will eventually hope across the pond) 

1. Atomisers may not hold more than 2ml of e-liquid

Kiss goodbye to your 5ml tanks as the new regulations will ensure that anything over the rather spartan limit of 2ml will be deemed to much increasing the amount of refilling required with no explanation given as to why this is a requirement of future e-cigarettes.

2. E-Liquid bottles may not contain more than 10ml

As with tanks, e-liquid bottles will be made smaller under the new rules making it a more time consuming task of refilling your e-cigarette, especially on the go, whilst the reduced quanitity that e-juice bottles will be able to hold means that more bottles and therefore more money will be required in order to receive the same amount of e-liquid as was previously the case. There will also be a cap on refillable bottles at 10ml (the current standard is 15-30ml).

3. E-Liquid may not contain more than 20 mg/ml of nicotine

At present, vapers have been able to make their own e-liquids to their requirements and customise the percentage of nicotine used in their juice, the TPD would introduce stringent rules on the level of nicotine allowed in a bottle of e-liquid, despite arguments about the toxicity of higher percentages of nicotine having been dispelled.

4. An E-Cigarette must deliver the same amount of vapour every time

The TPD will ensure that new e-cigarettes deliver a consistent vape with every puff that you take. Meaning that deep lung hits purchased on the regular marketplace will likely be a thing of the past. Moreover the difficulty for manufacturers (not just vapers) is that such an e-cigarette would not only limit the amount of vapour you’d be able to draw on, but that such a product doesn’t currently exist.

5. Manufacturers will have 6 months to design an e-cigarette which complies with TPD

This brings us to Paragraph 2 of Article 20 which states that E-cigarette manufacturers will have to notify the relevant authorities 6 months in advance of putting a new product on the market. Whilst this in itself is not an issue, the problems emerge when we realise that the specifications for this new generation of TPD approved e-cigarettes are not planned on being released until after that 6 month countdown to the deadline has already begun.

This will mean that companies face a race against time to first understand what the specifications of the TPD rules require and then design, re-design and prototype that product before submitting it to the regulator.

The price of failing to do so within that timeframe? All products that do not comply with TPD after 20th May 2017 will be removed from the market. Meaning that if no alternative is found before this date, the only e-cigarettes left on the market will be non-refillable cigalikes.

6. Less choice in E-Liquids

Fluid and emissions testing will mean that smaller, boutique e-liquid makers will be unable to afford the tests required to be able to release their products onto the market, putting them out of business and leaving e-liquid production solely to multinational companies that can cover the costs.

7. E-cigarettes must be tamper proof and protected against breakage and leakage

E-cigarettes and refillable containers must be child and tamper proof, and protected against breakage and leakage and a mechanism in place that ensures leak free refilling.

This means that the majority of e-cigarette tanks are made from pyrex glass to avoid the wear that e-liquid causes will now likely have to be made of the less durable metal, as glass is unlikely to be considered adequate for preventing breakage.

8. Restrictions on advertising and promotion

Under the new restrictions advertising e-cigarettes to the public by print, radio, televisual or public event media is prohibited except at conventions.

TL;DR

By the time TPD is rolled out across Europe it will be a harsh landscape for third gen e-cigarettes that have exploded in popularity over the last few years and creates conditions that are very favourable to big tobacco companies, who coincidentally produce the cigalike models which are least likely to help people to quit and who may be clogging the market in two years time.

[cesar]

The problem is that vaping is to cheap and legal at the moment, they need to make vaping a bad thing to excuse the high taxation that Tabaco have..

All that smokers not paying taxes for smoking will be catastrophic for the economy..... the sad truth.

 

[Earthling789]

The problem is that vaping is to cheap and legal at the moment, they need to make vaping a bad thing to excuse the high taxation that Tabaco have..

All that smokers not paying taxes for smoking will be catastrophic for the economy..... the sad truth.

 

​The sad truth is that our government and politicians are addicted to our tax dollars (far more than anyone could ever be addicted to a cigarette or alcohol), and they salivate over any scheme that will generate MORE revenues for their coffers.  They're all about taking from a small percentage of the public (so it's not seen as a blanket tax on everyone, which is illegal)... sin taxes on alcohol and tobacco... taxes levied on specific sectors of the economy... etc. etc. etc....  Lobbyists and special interests sway politicians (with a huge contribution) to make them see good/bad, right/wrong, saints/sinners through THEIR eyes, and all of a sudden there is a 10-cent tax on caffeine/sugar in your soda... a $2 tax on your tanning-bed session... a 20-cent increase on the cost of a chocolate bar... and heaven forbid you desire a 90-oz Big-Gulp... you may go to prison for that one....   Sodium is good... no, wait, now it's bad... Natural sugar is good, no, wait.. Saccharin is the savior.. .wait...no... Equate... no... Sweet-n-low... no... wait... High Fructose Corn Syrup... no... everyone is fat now... I know... Natural sugar... yeah, that's good...  

Government needs to learn to do more with less... just like the rest of us do... Get out of out of my pocket, out of my kid's school, out of my bedroom, out of my car, out of MY BUSINESS!

Catastrophic for the economy???  NO... it would not affect the economy negatively at all... it would affect the GOVERNMENT ONLY... in that they would not have money they can waste on their little pet projects like signs around an abandon building that say "Feral cats are not allowed on the premises"... or building 300 tunnels under a 50 mile stretch of roadway so turtles can use them to get to the other side of the road without getting squished...  or how about the wires stretched across the highway in the Northwest so the squirrels won't have to cross the road....  I can go on all day...

/rant-off

[cesar]

​The sad truth is that our government and politicians are addicted to our tax dollars (far more than anyone could ever be addicted to a cigarette or alcohol), and they salivate over any scheme that will generate MORE revenues for their coffers.  They're all about taking from a small percentage of the public (so it's not seen as a blanket tax on everyone, which is illegal)... sin taxes on alcohol and tobacco... taxes levied on specific sectors of the economy... etc. etc. etc....  Lobbyists and special interests sway politicians (with a huge contribution) to make them see good/bad, right/wrong, saints/sinners through THEIR eyes, and all of a sudden there is a 10-cent tax on caffeine/sugar in your soda... a $2 tax on your tanning-bed session... a 20-cent increase on the cost of a chocolate bar... and heaven forbid you desire a 90-oz Big-Gulp... you may go to prison for that one....   Sodium is good... no, wait, now it's bad... Natural sugar is good, no, wait.. Saccharin is the savior.. .wait...no... Equate... no... Sweet-n-low... no... wait... High Fructose Corn Syrup... no... everyone is fat now... I know... Natural sugar... yeah, that's good...  

Government needs to learn to do more with less... just like the rest of us do... Get out of out of my pocket, out of my kid's school, out of my bedroom, out of my car, out of MY BUSINESS!

Catastrophic for the economy???  NO... it would not affect the economy negatively at all... it would affect the GOVERNMENT ONLY... in that they would not have money they can waste on their little pet projects like signs around an abandon building that say "Feral cats are not allowed on the premises"... or building 300 tunnels under a 50 mile stretch of roadway so turtles can use them to get to the other side of the road without getting squished...  or how about the wires stretched across the highway in the Northwest so the squirrels won't have to cross the road....  I can go on all day...

/rant-off

​Catastrophic for the economy is what they want you to believe, we all know better thou.... they will save millions of tax payer money in medical bills alone. Vaping have to many enemies, tobacco companies, pharmaceutical companies, anti-smoking campaigners, children protection agencies... is up to us to educate people about vaping... well, the companies making e-cigarettes and e-liquids, let the general public know that vaping is not as evil as governments wants you to believe.

Edited June 12, 2015 by cesar

[MudDrum]

It does seem that the Vaping community has many enemies.
I think that it just a matter of time before serious restrictions are put in past.
Also see no way around it.
We, as a society, continually ask to be protected.
It has become an obsession for some to always answer that call.

[Holly North]

No I'm not hear about this before.  Thanks buddy for inform us about this.

[FXRich]

I think Kanger may be preparing for new regulations in Europe, they are coming out with a tank that's called a CLtank, the CL stands for child lock, supposedly the tank has a child proof fill. I highly suspect that's the reason that Subvods sold in Europe have a 1.8ml tank. I suspect once they start regulating them here they may even set a limit on wattage, or volts. I'm glad I have some unopened mods and tanks stockpiled.  

Edited April 13, 2016 by FXRich

[Christopher]

21 minutes ago, FXRich said:

I think Kanger may be preparing for new regulations in Europe, they are coming out with a tank that's called a CLtank, the CL stands for child lock, supposedly the tank has a child proof fill. I highly suspect that's the reason that Subvods sold in Europe have a 1.8ml tank. I suspect once they start regulating them here they may even set a limit on wattage, or volts. I'm glad I have some unopened mods and tanks stockpiled.  

Interesting, I agree this is probably in prep for some of the regulations coming into play in Europe. (Like TPD) 

[DuckysVapeReviews]

America just passed tons of regulations that ban anything made after 2007 from being sold after date it takes effect and any companies that started after that date can file motions and etc BUT they will more than likely be forced to shut down. Also, all non nicotine liquids will have to have on bottle " Made From Tobacco" even though it has no nicotine. Pharmaceutical companies are the ones pushing this because it takes cash from them. The new regulations do state vaping is exempt from tobacco taxes however but TABC still has a limited control over it. 499 pages of laws and regulations. Funny thing is, these pharmaceutical companies offer nicotine lollipops that they swear are not marketed to kids and somehow magically kids can't open the simple wrapper on them and eat them. They also will not be regulated as they are "medicinal OTC" 

[Christopher]

8 hours ago, DuckysVapeReviews said:

America just passed tons of regulations that ban anything made after 2007 from being sold after date it takes effect and any companies that started after that date can file motions and etc BUT they will more than likely be forced to shut down. Also, all non nicotine liquids will have to have on bottle " Made From Tobacco" even though it has no nicotine. Pharmaceutical companies are the ones pushing this because it takes cash from them. The new regulations do state vaping is exempt from tobacco taxes however but TABC still has a limited control over it. 499 pages of laws and regulations. Funny thing is, these pharmaceutical companies offer nicotine lollipops that they swear are not marketed to kids and somehow magically kids can't open the simple wrapper on them and eat them. They also will not be regulated as they are "medicinal OTC" 

I was thinking the same thing in regards the the lollipops. Hipopchary at it's finest.  Made from Tobacco warning labels on zero nic liq, makes absolutely no sense. It's going to be an interesting two years. If the regulation isn't changed via lawsuit or new or additional laws passed through congress, most of the brands selling today will likely pull out. I suspect we'll see a few large factories with heavy investment come into the market selling pass through liquid that's already been submitted for regulation. Thing is, any change in formulation, meaning proprietary white labeled liquids, would need to apply as well. So you're potentially looking at say 20-50 flavors depending on the financial backings, simply sold under different labels. Heck, the factories may even opt to pull out and simply sell their own creations. Hard to say really, as there so much information to plow through. 

We have a big round table meeting coming up this week and a couple of lawyers reviewing the info over the weekend, I'll likely draft an ELI5 (Explain like I'm 5) version for those looking to get the highlights. (Though ECF will probably have something up pretty quickly) 

[Bebop]

Really looking forward to hearing how your conference goes, Christopher.  Thanks for keeping us up on this.

[Christopher]

You're welcome. I just took over a hefty share of Vapor Talk after many years, so you'll see my face around here again quite often. We need to dust this place off a bit. 

[DuckysVapeReviews]

That's what I am trying to get going. Trying to post more and more of my reviews here and send people here to see them.

[InstantGMP]

Companies that have less than <$5 million in annual revenue have 24 months to start the compliance process and then their clock resets to an additional 36 months to complete the rest of the process. My company is comprised of all ex-pharma people and we agree that the best step, and the easiest step, is for manufacturers to start documenting their process. The FDA mantra is, if it isn't documented, then it wasn't done and this will really help companies. For an intro to the compliance process, click here.

[Earthling789]

@InstantGMP... why do I suddenly get the feeling you are a "compliance company", much like a "financial adviser"??  Both are interested in collecting the fees associated with "helping", rather than assisting anyone with an end-result....