I couldn't believe this..

[bcartervol98]

CA is not lucky either (at least L.A. isn't...) Things tend to take double the stated amount of time to get to me. Its pretty ridiculous. I complain to the post office regularly.... Needless to say, they don't like me, so maybe they just hold up my stuff on purpose...

The stuff I sent you and Crystalyn defies this rule lol. You got yours 3 days before she got hers and yours had to go from Tennessee to California and hers to Kentucky right next door. LOLmail.

With that said, there is not enough savings on earth to get me to order from a Chinese company direct. I bet over time the pain and aggravation is not worth it with how cheap stuff is here. I get it on some of the Mech Mods a lot of people like but for standard stuff just support US companies. As a GM dealer of 21 years this has always been a hot button issue for me. In the global economy with shipping between countries almost as easy as shipping between states we lose the ideals of supporting American companies.

The biggest thing lost in todays society imo is the fact that value and price are not synonymous and cheaper doesnt necessarily mean better.

Edited October 25, 2014 by bcartervol98

[jasonculp]

With that said, there is not enough savings on earth to get me to order from a Chinese company direct. I bet over time the pain and aggravation is not worth it with how cheap stuff is here. I get it on some of the Mech Mods a lot of people like but for standard stuff just support US companies. As a GM dealer of 21 years this has always been a hot button issue for me. In the global economy with shipping between countries almost as easy as shipping between states we lose the ideals of supporting American companies.

The biggest thing lost in todays society imo is the fact that value and price are not synonymous and cheaper doesnt necessarily mean better.

I struggle with this! I run into this all the time in my business and personal life. I am such a strong believer in keeping everything in the US. I have been in a few business dealings that have really blurred the lines for me and it has been very upsetting.

The first time was a very large auto manufacturer that had a bearing that they needed. We sourced the specifications to all the American bearing company's after all the samples were recieved none of the bearings could pass the quality and specifications that were required. We ended up making them with American steel in a Japanese plant in a joint effort. What had happened is the American tooling was out-dated and the Japanese/Chinese were not. I know this situation has got better in the past few years. Many new plants have been built and tooling updated in the US. This is so hard for American companies to make major changes while competing in a global market.

In my new job we do much more manufacturing. We are running into many quality issues from our normal US suppliers trying to cut corners to compete with the foreign ones. We are getting castings from European companies that are less expensive and higher quality than what we can get in the US. On this project we are having to import 50% of raw parts. We do the final machining, and assembly here in Texas, and then export the finished products. It is a crazy world.

In the gasket end of our business one example our supplier takes American raw materials and ships it to a Canadian company to make the finished product that we sell, and make more products out of.

I really don't know where to go from here. The owner of the company set out with a goal to run a "Christian Based" 100% American produced company. It has been nearly impossible. I wish it wasn't this way. We are a small company, less than 20 million/year and employ around 100 people. We have to build/test our products to near nuclear specifications. It really sucks when the foundry that is 30 miles away can't produce what we need for these projects (at any cost).

I wish I knew where we go from here. I wish I knew where the problem is. I know regulation has a lot to do with it, but we need regulations. I know lawsuits have a lot to do with the problem, but they are a necessary evil also. The labor is very high, but it is only a small part of it.

PS - I designed (I'm not an engineer) a mechanical mod that I thought would be simple and cheap. It basically was a 4nine style switch but with a lock and an adjustable top cap with a single tube. It was to be made from all US 316 stainless and C464/Naval Brass. Our CNC shop came up with a cost of $300/unit if we made 1000 units. Of course we can never produce it because our machines are too large to handle the small pieces in a mechanical mod.

PSS - I agree I would not care to deal direct with China. You have very little to no recourse if products do not work.

[bcartervol98]

I struggle with this! I run into this all the time in my business and personal life. I am such a strong believer in keeping everything in the US. I have been in a few business dealings that have really blurred the lines for me and it has been very upsetting.

The first time was a very large auto manufacturer that had a bearing that they needed. We sourced the specifications to all the American bearing company's after all the samples were recieved none of the bearings could pass the quality and specifications that were required. We ended up making them with American steel in a Japanese plant in a joint effort. What had happened is the American tooling was out-dated and the Japanese/Chinese were not. I know this situation has got better in the past few years. Many new plants have been built and tooling updated in the US. This is so hard for American companies to make major changes while competing in a global market.

In my new job we do much more manufacturing. We are running into many quality issues from our normal US suppliers trying to cut corners to compete with the foreign ones. We are getting castings from European companies that are less expensive and higher quality than what we can get in the US. On this project we are having to import 50% of raw parts. We do the final machining, and assembly here in Texas, and then export the finished products. It is a crazy world.

In the gasket end of our business one example our supplier takes American raw materials and ships it to a Canadian company to make the finished product that we sell, and make more products out of.

I really don't know where to go from here. The owner of the company set out with a goal to run a "Christian Based" 100% American produced company. It has been nearly impossible. I wish it wasn't this way. We are a small company, less than 20 million/year and employ around 100 people. We have to build/test our products to near nuclear specifications. It really sucks when the foundry that is 30 miles away can't produce what we need for these projects (at any cost).

I wish I knew where we go from here. I wish I knew where the problem is. I know regulation has a lot to do with it, but we need regulations. I know lawsuits have a lot to do with the problem, but they are a necessary evil also. The labor is very high, but it is only a small part of it.

PS - I designed (I'm not an engineer) a mechanical mod that I thought would be simple and cheap. It basically was a 4nine style switch but with a lock and an adjustable top cap with a single tube. It was to be made from all US 316 stainless and C464/Naval Brass. Our CNC shop came up with a cost of $300/unit if we made 1000 units. Of course we can never produce it because our machines are too large to handle the small pieces in a mechanical mod.

PSS - I agree I would not care to deal direct with China. You have very little to no recourse if products do not work.

When we remodeled our showroom two years ago we tried to only use products made in the USA and it was impossible just like it is impossible outside a very few exceptions to buy E-cig stuff made in the USA. What we did was the best we could do....we bought the stuff from a US supplier at least. Don't get me wrong I am not chastising those that order directly from China its just something my conscience and overall paradigm will not allow me to do.

Funny story. Back when the last Olympics were going on people (Fox News especially keyed in on this one) went ape over the fact the uniforms were made in China. A lot of my friends at the lake were going off about it in the cove all weekend when the story broke and became the headline du jour. When I pointed out the people complaining the most in my group drive Lexus, Acura and Toyota I was quick to point out the hypocrisy. We live in a society that wants to pick and choose when they feel Patriotism applies with the way they spend money and even though many products are "assembled" in the USA the parts and more importantly the profits are made and benefit the country of origin for all these companies.

I am also a Scoutmaster for one of the local Cub Scout packs and our Boy Scouts of America uniforms are made in Thailand or China. It drives me nuts.

Hardly ANY company can make a product like a car, electronics and other tech heavy items without parts or some assembly overseas because we have all but eliminated our ability to make them in an affordable manner domestically BUT if just a few people realize by supporting companies that export their profits from the USA to other countries a huge difference can be made.

Is American pride dead or just in critical condition? Is it a symptom of a global economy or are we so quick to try and save a buck if just doesn't come into play? I mean this as a serious question and am not trying to hijack the thread any further but I just cannot say nothing when this is one of my biggest "things" lol.

Sorry for the soap box lol.

[BDM53ENT]

Its ok to use the soapbox 98. You need to get your frustrations out because my Tide is coming to UT tonight LOL.

[bcartervol98]

Its ok to use the soapbox 98. You need to get your frustrations out because my Tide is coming to UT tonight LOL.

Sigh. It wont even be a game man. I am good friends with a couple of our coaches and not only are we terrible on offense our team has had the flu this whole week. Jalen Hurd has lost 10lbs this week from the virus and Worley is not likely to dress much less play. The only good thing is we are on the upswing and Bama is heading the other direction. This conversation will be a LOT more fun on my end in a couple years especially if Saban keeps Lane on staff. Either way I will be sipping bourbon in our box watching the pain happen. I am done boating to games for this year.

In the score prediction contest I have 41-10 Bama.

The only hope we have is if the fans truly transfer their anger toward Kiffin (which I think is silly I was glad to see the arrogant prick leave) and break noise records every time the Bama offense takes the field. We do have a great defense if the offense can stay on the field long enough for them to not be depleted in the 2nd half like the Ole Miss game last week.

[Bebop]

Interesting.... It's the same with guitars (and other musical instruments). You can buy an "american made" instrument (and Thats debateable itself as some components are imported for sure) but the Amercan made instrument is going to cost you 3 - 5 times the cost of an import. And the damning thing is the quality of the imports is exceptional! You can buy a quality guitar for $1500 and less while you will pay upwards of $3000 and more for something comparable with a name. How do you compete with that? Is that not the success story of Toyota and others?

I dont know what to do either but it doesnt give me much choice when recommending instruments to students.....

[BDM53ENT]

The thing with SEC football is any team, on any given day, can upset another. Im still pouting over the Bama Ole Miss game so dont loose hope. Im a Bama fan living dead center in a huge UT, Ole Miss fan base so I have to be careful

I get your rant on buying US and do as much as possible. The few things I do order direct from China are China made and have a 500% mark up here. Absolutely I will pay more for US made but I wont be raped by greedy distributors here. I think the Scout uniforms made in China representing a US tradition is a bit much, that would chap me also.

[bcartervol98]

Interesting.... It's the same with guitars (and other musical instruments). You can buy an "american made" instrument (and Thats debateable itself as some components are imported for sure) but the Amercan made instrument is going to cost you 3 - 5 times the cost of an import. And the damning thing is the quality of the imports is exceptional! You can buy a quality guitar for $1500 and less while you will pay upwards of $3000 and more for something comparable with a name. How do you compete with that? Is that not the success story of Toyota and others?

I dont know what to do either but it doesnt give me much choice when recommending instruments to students.....

Therein lies the dilemma. The auto industry is a little different but same concept. The thing the import manufacturers have done are open up non union assembly facilities sporadically throughout the US that pay median salaries when compared to other industries but seem to locate themselves where wages are lower, education levels are lower so they can maintain profitability. Hell a VW assembly facility just opened a few years ago in Chattanooga and they actively recruited fast food workers because they could pay lower wages and still maintain employee loyalty because there are not a lot of other options in the workplace for their employees. They do this so that can taut they are "Built in the USA" when in reality they ship all the parts in from the corporations home country to be assembled here and sold then the profits from that sale also go overseas. Did you know for every 1% market share the imports gain on the domestic auto companies roughly 18000 jobs are lost here?

Maybe I am getting old (44) and grumpy and I definitely have a dog in the hunt financially but things like this drive me as crazy as seeing a Toyota Camry driving down the street with a "Proud WWII Veteran" sticker on the back. Talk about irony.

But then again, these are just my feelings and everyone looks at things differently. Talking about a Vamo (and not likely a real Vamo but rather a knockoff) for $26 or whatever is hardly 500% markup to buy it here for $40-$45 from a reputable supplier in the US. is not that big a deal to me to just pay a little extra, have it in 2-3 days or less and have full recourse should something happen to it.

Its all a vicious cycle. Price oriented shoppers buy overseas made products to save a few bucks, American companies cannot compete because we do not let 10 year olds work 12 hour days in factories, jobs are lost and American companies have to charge more because it costs more to employ people in the environment we have here. My business grosses around $250k-$275k per month just from the sales department and after salaries, healthcare, taxes and all the other expenses we have turned a net profit in only 3 of the first 9 months this year EVEN THOUGH our sales have increased 10-12% per year since 2009. The government is regulating us out of business and laying in wait are the countries that make products with no environmental regulations, no labor laws and can ship their products to the US with little to no tariff while charging exorbitant tariffs on our exports which now are primarily agricultural products.

[subnuclear]

When i was forced to be in a union our uniforms by union decree had to be American Made. When i would tear a shirt in the plant it would cost me 60 bucks to replace a basic polo style blue shirt. (we had a uniform allowance that would pay for up to 3 uniforms per year, THat would last me about 3 months because there were A LOT of metal banded claddings in the plant). I hated the fact that i had to pay 4x value for American Made.

I work very hard for my money. Every day i come home and take anti inflammtory meds like advil to reduce swelling and pain from a hard day of work. When i buy something i want the best value for my hard earned dollar. If that means i buy from china or japan or from products from those countries then that is what i'll do. The more our country screams to raise minimum wage and regulate corporations out of existence the more we will buy foreign made products. It is not a question of patriotism for me. I served my country. I am a veteran and during my service we had multiple hazard zone patrols. I do not equate buying for value with not being a patriot.

I do have companies i will not buy from because i believe they are anti american. I'll never buy another GM product because of their bailout and transfer of wealth to Unions. I buy ford because when i shopped around for a full size car they had by far the best bang for the buck. When i wanted a truck (2009) there was no other company that could compete with the price i got on my F150. when i wanted a small commuter car nothing seemed to compare to the focus i got that i was getting 39 to 41 MPG from. But i don't buy them because they are an American company. That is a bonus.

I think your statement was True bcarter. We Have regulated and unionized to the point that American companies simply can't produce a product (in the mass production market) that competes with foreign made products.

ON a side note i luckily work for an American based oilfield manufacturing company that builds an outstanding product. Still we outsource our control functions and products to Norway because well that seems to be where all the PLC designers and programmers are lol. all the oilfield companies i've worked for seem to outsource their control systems and software to Norway.

[jasonculp]

I think your statement was True bcarter. We Have regulated and unionized to the point that American companies simply can't produce a product (in the mass production market) that competes with foreign made products.

ON a side note i luckily work for an American based oilfield manufacturing company that builds an outstanding product. Still we outsource our control functions and products to Norway because well that seems to be where all the PLC designers and programmers are lol. all the oilfield companies i've worked for seem to outsource their control systems and software to Norway.

We are very similar. We build different components for oilfield, power plants, and municipalities. We also import a lot of small pieces from your area of the world.

[oliviamia168@yahoo.com]

Those are great prices if it's true ? - no hidden costs ?

[DJ Colonel Corn]

No different than Fasttech. Fasttech has the the SS Vamo 6 for $26.49 and the SS Vamo 5s for $26.25. Thing is you will be waiting on it for 4 weeks and if you have an issue with it, you will be paying twice that to get it replaced.

Yes actually it's quite different, and it only takes 8-10 days, and, they have a 45-day replacement policy with shipping included.

So I had to comment on behalf of Fasttech, who I do business with regularly, and have had no problems with them, and I can say a friend recently got excellent support by contacting them so...... no, FastTech is NOT like most online vape/etc chinese distributors. Worldiwide free shipping too.

[Tam]

Yes actually it's quite different, and it only takes 8-10 days, and, they have a 45-day replacement policy with shipping included.

So I had to comment on behalf of Fasttech, who I do business with regularly, and have had no problems with them, and I can say a friend recently got excellent support by contacting them so...... no, FastTech is NOT like most online vape/etc chinese distributors. Worldiwide free shipping too.

Everyone will get a different result. Some will like Fasttech and say they get great service, fast shipping. Others will have nothing but trouble with them. I'm one of the latter. So far every order I've made with them has taken weeks to get to me. I'm not talking about batteries, either. My last order was for plastic drip tips. After FOUR weeks, they finally emailed to tell me they couldn't get me the drip tips I ordered. It took even longer for them to get me a refund.