christov11 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I know this has been asked before but I cant seem to find a specific thread. Im going with logic and posted this but again cant find the thread. I would think that wraps didnt need to be so close together to produce more vapor since the wick has more breathing room and more of the wick gets heat? I know its not "supposed to be that way and seems to chuck better when theyre tighter together but I would like to understand the logic behind it! Other thing is the circumference... wrapping around a bigger screwdriver vs a smaller one. What does this do? once again if i fit a bigger wick through then there is more surface area to vaporize juice hence more vapor? Kindof trying to get behind the logic/science of all these different builds I see. a lot fo them look really cool but then when i sit back and think of it... a lot seem useless for producing the most vapor and huge clouds... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bebop Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 (edited) It's all about surface area or coil surface in contact with the wick. The primary surface area is the inside of the coil in contact with the wicking material. The secondary surface area is the outside of the coil which also collects juice but burns off quickly. In a micro coil (many small diameter wraps) you have essentially a barrel surface area heating up the wick. As you increase the diameter of the coil you also increase the amount of wick and therefore less juice in direct contact. Somewhere in there is a happy medium- just the right surface area paired with just the right amount of wick. Of course, the thicker the wire, the lower the resistance which allows more wraps. Again, a balance of resistance to surface area. In theory, the lower resistance couple with the most surface area and greatest power gives the most vapor, however all those factors must be balanced so as to avoid dry hits, swamped coil, burned hits, wicking action inconsistency etc.... Edited September 2, 2014 by Bebop12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christov11 Posted September 2, 2014 Author Share Posted September 2, 2014 So the coil can almost be covered in cotton? and something like a 20g will have less resistance (ohms) than a 28g with the same amount of wraps and diameter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bebop Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 So the coil can almost be covered in cotton? and something like a 20g will have less resistance (ohms) than a 28g with the same amount of wraps and diameter? Swamping the coil can defeat it. It needs airflow to produce wicking action and vapor. Given the same amount of wraps (and diameter size) thicker wire has less resistance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christov11 Posted September 2, 2014 Author Share Posted September 2, 2014 (edited) Ah ok cool! Makes sense now! On that note... New tobh is about to get a solid build! I need thicker kenthal.... Edited September 2, 2014 by christov11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christov11 Posted September 2, 2014 Author Share Posted September 2, 2014 so lets see if I understood... with the lack of thicker wire... I could do more wraps with smaller diameter to get more vapor production.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bebop Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Yes you could. The smaller diameter of the coil would give you more wraps to achieve same resistance. Probably only a wrap or two, depends. Imagine that your total length of wire is 2 inches. Well you could take that wire and make 3 big wraps or 10 tiny wraps as an example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christov11 Posted September 3, 2014 Author Share Posted September 3, 2014 Beauty! Thanks a million bebop!!! Gonna try to get this huge a*s tobh going tonight! I found my builds for the stillairs 7wrap 28g but I warp(not wrap) so it's not a strait spring looking. Seems to work better than when I was putting it strait isn't as clean as it could be but here... They put out craziness in the sky! Only 0.51ohms Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bebop Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 There is also a principle with micro coils where the wraps actually touch each other. This essentially lowers the resistance even more with a lot of surface area as the electricity can flow across the coil, not just through the wire. This is what the sub ohm guys are doing when they compress the wraps of the coil to touching each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christov11 Posted September 3, 2014 Author Share Posted September 3, 2014 So since the current flows through the touching wraps it allows you to get more surface area with less resistance. Right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bebop Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 Yup. And that means lots of heat and lots of......clouds lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christov11 Posted September 3, 2014 Author Share Posted September 3, 2014 (edited) I'm gonna try that out then... Especially since the posts are so far apart on the big tobh Can't thank you enough! Edited September 3, 2014 by christov11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bebop Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 Sure 'nuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christov11 Posted September 3, 2014 Author Share Posted September 3, 2014 Might aswell keep this up! Not to overuse your great knowledge though... Hahaha Does this mean I could technically go down to 0.1 ohm builds? Or am I reading this wrong...? I just wanna be safe! 26650 battery goes 3.7v 35amps 3500mah.... The 18650 is an efest at 3.7 but I think 20amps(gonna get another set soon for more amps) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bebop Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 The math is correct..... The sensibility is suspect...... (that's a joke haha) I'm joking because .1 ohm is practically a short. Haha christov11 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raptor Vaper Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 Might aswell keep this up! Not to overuse your great knowledge though... Hahaha Does this mean I could technically go down to 0.1 ohm builds? Or am I reading this wrong...? I just wanna be safe! 26650 battery goes 3.7v 35amps 3500mah.... The 18650 is an efest at 3.7 but I think 20amps(gonna get another set soon for more amps) That's the constant discharge rate. The pulsing discharge rate is somewhere around 60-65 amps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christov11 Posted September 3, 2014 Author Share Posted September 3, 2014 (edited) Hit this and it's not chucking as much as I thought... It also took a bit longer to glow than my single strand coils with same wraps etc... Any suggestions? Plus the top of the mod gets warm.. Normal I guess I just rewicked it... maybe i had too thick in there or too much... gonna see at next break. Edited September 3, 2014 by christov11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bebop Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 Yeah, you have gaps here and there creating inconsistencies. Any reason why you didn't twist the wire first before forming the coil? Those gaps create hot and cold spots and make the current flow inconsistent (as well as resistance inconsistent). A well made coil that is consistent heats from the center out and in a dual coil heats evenly on both sides... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christov11 Posted September 3, 2014 Author Share Posted September 3, 2014 It's going evenly but isn't heating up as much... I just improvised on making them haha made 2 seperate singles and then "screwed" them together so that it would be as if they were wrapped in parallel... I'll be rebuilding tonight some singles or maybe give the parallel another shot by twisting the ends together like you said... Maybe a quad coil would be ok? 4x7 wrapped 28g? Tinkering for days! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christov11 Posted September 4, 2014 Author Share Posted September 4, 2014 attempted a 4 x 6 wrap vertical build... horrible hahahaha at least im having fun! I wanna make something tht really chucks but i doubt thats gonna happen until i get thicker kanthal... URRRGHHH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonculp Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 I just built a dual/parallel, vertical, 26ga, 6 wrap, .45ohm. It is ok. It is fun to just play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christov11 Posted September 4, 2014 Author Share Posted September 4, 2014 Dude awesome!!! Get some pics up! Was it clean? Hot vape? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonculp Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 (edited) I like it so far. I wicked it over the top of the screws and left tails in the drip wells. I think it cut my airflow. I do like that i don't get any splatter off of it and it is not an extremely hot vape. I can't find my narrow tweezers so I can't get the coils as pretty as I would like. I am also going to rewick and run it just in the drip wells and see how it works. I don't know why I can't seem to take a good picture either! I have tried my iphone4 and my bigger digital. Neither is doing a good job! Edited September 4, 2014 by jasonculp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tam Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 I don't know why I can't seem to take a good picture either! I have tried my iphone4 and my bigger digital. Neither is doing a good job! Are you using the macro setting on your digital camera? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonculp Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 (edited) Are you using the macro setting on your digital camera? Yes, but I think I am not patient, or steady enough. It has also turned out to be a kinda cheap camera. I loaned my good one to my daughter for their family vacation last year, and never got it back. I have learned with the kids, if they have something of yours over 24 hours, it is now theirs! Edited September 4, 2014 by jasonculp christov11 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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