Do I need to start stockpiling?

[jerryjoe]

I read in a post yesterday that someone was stocking up on a particular item to prepare for the possibility that the FDA might shut us down. I'm paraphrasing, I believe the phrase said something about preparing for the FDA wars. I tried to find the post and couldn't - I think I was moving too fast.

Anyway my question: is this something I need to be concerned about?

Everything I read says they made a ruling on the 24th of April about keeoing e-cigs and specifically nicotine products away from minors. Definitely a good thing. But nowhere did I see anything about shutting down vaping completely.

I'm sure big tobacco wouldn't mind but banning vaping all together seems like a stretch. Or is it?

What would they ban? Batteries? Tanks? E-Juice? All of it?

So, should I be stocking up stuff?

Or possibly I should be moving faster to learn how to build all this stuff myself, juice included.

What are your thoughts fellow vapers?

[Tam]

Even if the FDA decides to ban the sale of vaping gear and juice, there will be a lead time and it won't happen overnight. I'm taking that post as a "the sky is falling" thing and I'll wait to see what the outcome is. CASAA has been working diligently (with our help), to make sure vaping isn't banned outright. And that's my two cents.

[Bebop]

It's difficult to forsee a full ban. I just dont know how it's possible. Largely due to the fact that DIY is so easy. I could see saving a few tanks, not tossing your spent coils. Get a roll of kanthal.

Even then how do you ban this stuff? It's just not practical. I see heavy taxation, strict regulation which means the little guy will be out and big tobacco moves in.

It's all about controlling an industry that's here to stay. And only the veterans will be upset as they will remember "the way it was".

[Earthling789]

Yep, it's all about regulation and control by "preferred" vendors/suppliers... AKA, those that have the best lobby in DC, or own/bought a few politicians... The second part of this all boils down to insane tax rates on cigarettes and tobacco products, which are the driving force pushing people towards vaping (or quitting all-together). The gov't is not getting the revenue from cigarettes they did before the 2009 SCHIP tax increase of $0.61/pack; therefore, they want/need another source of revenue. Vaping is an up-and-coming group of products, and since you "can" obtain nicotine via vapor, the tobacco companies, FDA, Surgeon General, CDC, and DC's finest nannies ALL presume they can regulate/tax vaping to the full extent they currently tax all other tobacco products... to secure their next few decades of revenue! You know... because "it's for the children, and public-health, and public-safety... and for the children" (yes I repeated that on purpose).

[mcquinn]

My opinion is that things will change sometime. We don't know when but it will change. If you are vaping to beat an addiction you probably should buckle down and start working to no nic . If you are just trying to beat the system you need to start allowing for a huge cost increase and less choices in your future. This comes up every year since vaping started and every year there are folks stocking up for "Armageddon" I have been at this for quite some time and I can do with or without the nic. I feel confident I can just stop if I don't like what happens when it happens. Good luck and enjoy while you can.

[Compenstine]

Things will change and depending on the rulings things may or may not be good changes. The FDA will not give up. Not selling to minors, That is just common sense and most do this already. Child proof caps, yeah not a problem. Forcing the registration fees and high cost of testing for each flavor sold, that is what will kill most small companies. Only allowing products that have been on the market since 2007. That means everything but the cigalikes will be removed until they are tested and approved. They are talking 10s of thousands of dollars per flavor and for devices. Do what you feel you need to do, but changes are coming.

[jerryjoe]

Do what you feel you need to do, but changes are coming.

That's why I was asking....because I don't know what to do. I'm new to this but I know that I haven't smoked in over a month. I also know that the possibility that vaping could be taken away from me scares me and pisses me off at the same time.

But if what we're talking about is regulating e-juice manufacturing and turning it's production over to big tobacco or mega companies, while that would suck for small, independent juice makers, it's far different than banning batteries, tanks and coils (or atomizers/cartomizers).

I used to make candy back in the day. I can get my hands on drams of flavoring and vegetable glycerin. Not so sure about nicotine, presumably that would be regulated/off limits too.

But if I have to learn to build my own APV's, I might want to stock up on parts to get me through to the point where I can do it myself.

That was my real question. Do I need to be spending every minute of the two weeks I'm off every month learning as fast as I can to become a perfect device manufacturer? Is the impending doom that drastic? Are they gonna take my ability to buy APV's? Is it gonna happen soon? Like in the next couple months?

Edited May 25, 2014 by jerryjoe

[Compenstine]

Yes what the FDA has planned will drop vaping into the laps of Big Tobacco and Pharma. There are things they can't ban and DIY is a big one. Not sure how hard NIC will be to get but I'm sure you will be able to get it. I don't see a need to hoard items as this will not be that bad. But, a lot of the flavors most people enjoy now will go away. Follow CASAA and do your part by contributing your voice to the calls for action. Grimm Green did a good video explaining how things look in the eyes of CASSA and I would suggest viewing it.

[jerryjoe]

Yes what the FDA has planned will drop vaping into the laps of Big Tobacco and Pharma. There are things they can't ban and DIY is a big one. Not sure how hard NIC will be to get but I'm sure you will be able to get it. I don't see a need to hoard items as this will not be that bad. But, a lot of the flavors most people enjoy now will go away. Follow CASAA and do your part by contributing your voice to the calls for action. Grimm Green did a good video explaining how things look in the eyes of CASSA and I would suggest viewing it.

Thanks for that link. It was a very interesting vlog. I need some time to process that information. I also need some time to do more research. I will get back to this topic once I have more facts. Thanks Compenstine.

[jerryjoe]

About five or ten years ago I was struggling with the rising cost of analogs. Not because I couldn't afford them but in general principal it was offensive to be paying increasingly higher prices to partake in an activity that I was sure was bad for me. So I found a way around the system. I bought loose tobacco, these things called "tubes" which, for those of you who don't know, is the every part of a cigarette (the white paper part and the filter) except the tobacco and a little machine that allowed me to insert the tobacco in the tube. It sucked at first. I wasn't very good at it. But over time I mastered my technique and was making them as good as any store bought. Things went on like that for years.

I was paying $6-$8 per carton of cigarette.

Then big tobacco stepped in. They were loosing money. They wanted the laws changed. It didn't take long. I was told by the store I bought my stuff from to expect a price increase in my supplies. Sure I thought, I'm only paying $6/carton....$10 won't be so bad.

When the change went into effect my $6 cartons had jumped to $38. Long story short it didn't make sense to do all that work when I could get a carton of Pall Malls for $30.

And this is similar to that. The info I found stated that the tobacco industry generates 500 BILLION USD per year (worldwide). Americas share is around 35 Billion (these figures were as of 2010). There is no way in hell that big tobacco is going to ignore vaping. I multiplied 365 by 4 by one miliion. That is a pack day habit at an average of $4 per pack for one million people. That's how many people I would guess world wide have switched from analogs to vaping. That estimate may be low. That is 1.5 Billion dollars in lost revenue. The only thing that amazes me is that big tobacco hasn't made it's move sooner.

I won't get into my history of taking up the rallying cry against the unfair treatment of the underdog. I am a huge fan of the underdog. But this situation doesn't look good for the underdog. I believe the underdog has two years to do what it can and then say goodbye. I've seen on a personal level what fighting the government gets. And insanely wealthy individuals/corporations can't be any different. I'm not saying don't fight, I'm saying go into this knowing what you are up against. I'm a realist not a pessimist. I will sign any petition asking for fair treatment and inclusion of the independant vaping business owner. I will call senators and congressmen. I will make posts like this.

But in two years I need to be prepared to make it on my own. I need to know as many ways as possible to build a mod and I need to know how to make my own juice. The only part of my plan that I'm concerned about is what the availability of liquid nicotine is going to be like in two years. I suppose it's possible big brother will reign that under it's control too. Right now I can get a 500 ml bottle of my 24mg strength for $25. That may not be possible after the changes take effect. At that time I will either have to be weened off nic all together or I'll have to get it from whichever suppliers can afford the costly and time consuming process of getting FDA approved.

I'm not too jazzed about looking at a botlle of caramel mochaccino 24 mg with a Marlboro label on it. But I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.

Edited May 25, 2014 by jerryjoe