kwaione Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 HEy everyone out there in vapor world... I had a bad accident happen to me a couple years ago right around the time I shut my business down (for the mean time) temporarily... Anyways the following I am going to tell you is a very true story and I kept it mostly a secret because for some reason I thought it getting out could "hurt" the e-cig community and hurt what was going on with F.D.A .. I mean as far as I thought I did not want to be the "example" they used to stop sales or trade of liquid nicotine products.. BUT now i think it may help you all to know what can happen and how quickly someone will perish if they consume nicotine in the following way.... here is my story: A couple years ago I was sleeping.. Was not drunk, High, or ANYTHING except for ...sleeping.. I was on a medication for hormones that made my mouth so dry I could not swallow. Anyways to let you know back then I would buy my nicotine at 500Mg/Ml VG.. I would then put it in the fridge to keep it out of light and heat which destroy nicotine, as I think since they store it nitrogen cooled before they ship it to keep it fresh it only makes since to put it in the fridge seeing how cold slows down progress.. Well I got up in the middl of the night and must have been sleep walking AND thirsty and it was about 9 am in the morning.. I was completely asleep when next thing I knew I took a swallow of 500Mg/Ml nicotine solution,, As SOON AS that nicotine touched my tongue I woke up! I instantly rinsed my mouth out and ran REAL QUICK outside and was yelling for help as there was a neighbor I had never met before across the street I was yeling at to call 911.. they were using a table saw , turned it off, I said call 911 and they shook there head and turned there saw back on! *******! then i went to the neighbors house and banged loudly on the door and when she anwered I told her her this "I swallowed 500mg/ml nicotine and you need to call 911 and tell them I swallowed 500mg/ml nicotine solution 500mg/ml and I am going to pass... then face planted into the lawn into a normal grass lawn but at the time it looked like the field in the wizard of oz that is all colorful... MIND you that it was LESS than 1 MINUTE from when that nicotine touched my tongue and the time I was unconcious.. It was not even enough time to call 911 myself... seriously I was out cold in less than a minute... THEN WHAT? Well I woke up a week YES 7 DAYS later and they told me I had A-Phibrilation (sp) also called "A-Phib" which is when your blood pressure decreases SO low that it pools in the heart... They told me it took 7 days to get the nicotine out of my blood and the whole time I was unconcious.. I have a heart arythmia from it and am not on blood pressure medicine (Beta Blockers) ... So the moral of this story is DUCK TAPE YOUR MAIN NICOTINE BOTTLES SO THAT NO ONE CAN ACCIDENTLY GET INTO THEM!!! Drinking nicotine will kill you! I am not even joking.... I damn near died because I had it in a unlocked container! I am all better now and put duct tape around the liter bottles now so that if I did sleep walk again to get a drink i won't "Accidently" drink the half pure nicotine... Now I buy PURE (well 99.8%) nicotine and I would have ben dead if I would have consumed that! ONE DROP OF PURE NICOTINE ON THE SCALP WILL KILL YOU! THE AMOUNT IN ONE CIGARETTE IF EXTRACTED OR EATEN WILL KILL YOU! No joking here nicotine will make you die one of those seizure atrophied muscle type deaths and watching someone die from that would be heartbreaking so do yourself a favor and take this story as a lesson on how serious this stuff is when it high MG like that... even 100mg/ml could kill you so PLEASE BE SAFE!! I know this sounds like I am an idiot but things happen on accident and this just happened to be that .. so please no negative comments would be appreciated Thank you for reading! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitsune Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 That really is a scary story, and you are a very, very lucky man !!! I know the FDA is always looking for damaging information, however, nicotine is legal and it wasn't a vaping accident. I am glad you shared your story....Nicotine is a very dangerous drug in high doses, and I think we can forget just how dangerous. I am glad you are still with us !!! I would add a lock to a container in addition to duct tape.... kwaione 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwaione Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 Hey thanks Kitsune! Well I duct tape it from top to 3/4 down the bottle so it takes some elbow to get into it plus I hide it now lol thanks! kitsune 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twelveday Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 man that is scary, i buy 36mg nic only and that story already makes me scared of that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 500mg (which is per ML by the way) is a very very high concentrate. It shouldn't be duct taped, in fact, it should be locked up in a chemical facility. The moment I read you kept it in your refrigerator I already knew where this story was headed. Glad you're ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwaione Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 yea I know lol.. I do NOT store pure nicotine I cut it down to 200MG/ML now and keep it in the closet away from the sun.. to dangerous at higher amounts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffb Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 daleron and kitsune 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danpio1217 Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 500mg?? I didn't even know they made liquid that strong. Glad you're ok, but some pretty no-brainer stuff could prevent an accident like this, and I don't mean to sound like i'm negatively commenting, but your 'moral of the story' is off and still isn't safe, especially if you're not the only one in the residence. Duct taping the bottle is not fixing what's wrong with this picture in my mind. 1. 500mg liquid in just unneccessary and dangerous. I understand everyones got different preferences but at that level you're begging for something bad to happen. I know nothing about DIY but if 500mg liquid is required, you shouldn't store it where people regularly go to consume food and liquids. 2. Along those lines... if you're going to refrigerate it get a minifridge or something. Who wants a bottle of poison sitting in their fridge? Duct taped or not... Again, don't mean to sound negative, to be honest I'm still concerned for your safety. Be safe and be smart... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwaione Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 I said that after that I do not keep it higher than 200mg/ml as I buy it pure then cut it down immediately to a safer amount to work with... I no longer store it anywhere where anyone could get ahold of it but this was 2 years ago Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwaione Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 (edited) also our home is also our e-liquid business so am i not suppose to have nicotine in the house? It is just the wife and I and she knows how to properly handle them... And I ordered it at 500mg/ml and then stored it to cut down further i never ever work with 500mg/ml I cut that down even further to 1-200mg/ml Edited May 4, 2012 by kwaione Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danpio1217 Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Never said don't have it in the house, but if you have something that strong i wouldn't store it in the same place you store your food & drink. If you have an office or basement maybe keep all the business stuff there as a little lab area and get a minifridge for storage. Just saying that's a bottle of poison sitting right next to your eggs & milk. I wouldn't be comfortable with that. Like Chris said, something that strong should be locked up. Really not trying to sound negative or judgemental at all, just want to make sure you realize if a severe accident like that happened once, duct tape isn't going to keep it from happening again. Duct tape may fix everything... but this is an instance i'd opt for something a little more high security lol. Happy vaping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwaione Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 oh yea I know that after this incident it is locked up in a dry, cold closet that locks.. But what I meant was I duct tape it on top of securing it safely, yes it was stupid the first time I did it but learned my lesson on that and quit doing it immediately lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwaione Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 Tape it up , lock it up and no one knows where so nothing like that can ever happen again... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danpio1217 Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Duct tape the bottle, put it in a box. Duct tape the box, put it in a safe. Duct tape the safe (....?), bury it in an underwater tank, put the tank in a closet, and duct tape the door shut. NOW it's secure. lmao kwaione 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Thanks for sharing that with us. Accidents happen and I'm glad you're still alive. Is the cost that much cheaper when you get pure nic or 500mg/ml? Are there any other advantages? I only see disadvantages with that. I use 60mg/ml for my own diy and I have 100mg/ml that I will cut down before mixing. I might just cut all my nic down to 36 to be a little safer since I vape it at 18-24 and it's easier and more accurate when making small batches for myself. One other question, how long after the 7 days did it take you to recover and do you have any permanent injuries? Uma and kwaione 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwaione Posted May 5, 2012 Author Share Posted May 5, 2012 lol Danpio your right though lol.. and MIKE I buy it because I mix a lot of juice, but the reason is if you ask for nicotine at ANY strength with PG or VG it cost much more than just buying the nicotine.. if you get pure or 500 or even 36mg/ml it will cost the same as the 500mg/ml ... no matter how much MG/ML it is priced the same so i buy it pure and mix it immediatly upon delivery... I work with 100mg/ml and you can do so without gloves as you can wipe it before it soaks in.. ALTHOUGH i rec ALWAYS use Nitrile gloves while making it as it is safer and more clean.. I will never ever store the nic at that high anymore but I do and will get the pure nic and mix it on arrival down and then store it in a cool dry dark place locked up WITH duct tape lmfao.. If you have any more questions feel free to write me PM or ask here thanks ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwaione Posted May 5, 2012 Author Share Posted May 5, 2012 I was fine when i came to, I have no other adverse affects from it not sure if it made me need blood pressure meds or not but I do take those since the accident.. but I think it might be unrelated thank for asking! And yes a Major accident lol Uma 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uma Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 Sheesh, I'm glad you're okay! I'm surprised your wife hasn't handcuffed you to the bed yet.... A lockable box by Vault might help make things safer and they're small enough to not take up too much room in the fridge. kwaione 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwaione Posted May 6, 2012 Author Share Posted May 6, 2012 Hey Danpio1217 I just realized you started vaping around April of this year? I thought you were old school vapor so let me explain something about strong e-liquid .. almost and I say almost cause not all do but almost all E-Liquid places that mix there own order high % nicotine 500-1000MG/ML because 100mg/ml cost the same and the same amount of shipping because you pay based on weight and 1 Kilo is 1 liter of e-liquid so lets say I bought a bottle of 36mg/ml VG/PG that would be the same price and weight as a bottle of 200 or 500 or 800 Or 1000MG/ML! I am a manufacturer of E-liquid and sell bulk by the liter, I have been shut down due to 4 surgeries unrelated to this incident so when you say I should NOT have high strength at all.. well how else would I get it here!?!?! I cant spend a 1000$ on 4 liters when I can get 10 100mg/ml worth for the 5th the cost shipped! A LOT of vendors in the USA and around the world start off with pure nic and I know of at least a dozen vendor friends that used to buy 2-liter washed out pop bottles of 100mg/ml and they and I we use that to work with because it is simple math 6mg/ml in 10ml equals .6ml of 100mg/ml, if someone wants 36mg/ml its 3.6ml of 100mg/ml... and the only way to get hurt from that strength is to spill it on yourself and just sit there for minutes on end waiting for it to soak in, but we wear gloves and all that as well and if it does get on the skin we just wash it off.. WITHOUT SOAP because soap will help it into your skin and into your bloodstream never use soap to wash off any chemicals it will help it absorb.... But yea high high strength nicotine is not something new and not something only I do majority does it! Actually i know a few companies that are on THIS forum that use pure nicotine and store it with liquid nitrogen its nothing new and we are very cautious and safe,,, its not like we just party and chill around a bunch of nicotine ,,, no lol We have Zero guests over due to Religion .. my wife is from Bangkok,Thailand and part of her culture is you do not have people over to your house but you meet those people out around town to eat, go to mall, movies etc.. so the home more than less is where your hearth is (not sure if that's correct word but...) its where you have privacy.. so no friends come over and no one knows *exactly* where we live when it comes to local people because we do not have guests over and I know for sure with being around e-liquid in high strengths for 3 years my wife is hardly going to untape a bottle that's taped from top all the down to drink or touch nicotine why would she do that lol? see what i am saying now? and when I say tape it up I did not mean tape it up and put it on the coffee table, but if you must have something like that secure is best as possible and hardcore tape and a locked safe or locked closet is all I need because neither one of us is going to go through the motions to open that without proper care and without us doing it who could? No one we are very private people and no accident can happen again unless it was deliberate... the 10mg/ml stuff I store that next to the computer WHILE USING IT then I put it back in the back corner of my closet where its cold and dry... I just kinda thought it strange that you had not heard about high strength nicotine being used but I am not really the exception I am more the norm although my accident was an exception.. But the likely hood of an accident of that type is almost impossible to happen since it would take 10 minutes to peel that tape off... and I highly doubt all the suppliers that make juice keep it in a safe , they probably label it with HAZMAT information and lock it in a cupboard or something along those lines.. if your properly trained which i am to handle chemical of a volatile substances, i took a HAZMAT class and such... minus the drinking nic accident what i am doing is fairly normal thought I would throw this out there thanks no offense to you we is all learnin lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 I knew about that super high concentrate but it didn't make much sense to me until now. Thanks for the inside look at what juice supplier's do. For small time do it yourselfers like me a quarter-liter of PG with nic @ 48, 36 or 100mg/ml will last me for months and the price is cheap enough that it isn't an issue. I just get what I like to use. I got the 100mg/ml PG-nic to I could try out some high VG mixes without having to buy my nic in VG but I'm most comfortable using 60mg/ml base or cutting it with vg and having a 36mg/ml flavorless base. I make about 4 10ml bottles and a couple of 3-5 ml samples a week for myself to vape and save for later and to share with friends. Having to fill orders when there are so many different flavors and nic levels and doing it on a much larger scale is still a bit beyond my comprehension and I have no desire to go there. I don't want to discourage anyone from DIY because it's fun and rewarding but you need not know what your doing and be as safe as you can. Not only DIYers but all vapers who have bottles of juice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveesl Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 I purchase 60mg and as soon as I receive it I immediately dilute that down to 15mg. We are actually down to less than that, but 15 gives me a good start point to further reduce and as the nic level drops due to time it is okay. The 15mg is put into sealed glass jars which I double bag in heavy gauge sealed bags. This is then put into a locked floor level cabinet. I have no kids and my dog is too old to try anything, but I have a great respect for toxic substances. When working with the initial 60mg concentrate I wear nitrile gloves and a full face guard and long sleeve shirt. Everything is mixed by exact measurement (no drops, milliliters), all mixing and filling is done on a large plastic pan with paper towels covering the bottom so I can immediately see any spills. Thats just me, your mileage may vary. dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwaione Posted May 8, 2012 Author Share Posted May 8, 2012 for sure.. if your not making bulk amounts by all means get the lower nic, no reason to get it pure or high concentration unless your planning on using it to make a TON of juice.. I do the same Dave I put on nitriles , face mask, and surgical gown.. I also where a thick chefs coat under it all to absorb any mess's I may encounter so it does not touch me skin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willmon22 Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 Wow I didn't know a drop of pure nicotine on the scalp could kill someone. Anyways I would say that you really are lucky to be alive. And I would assume after that happening the doctors say that you won't be able to vape again because of getting the heart condition. I guess this would be one reason I wouldn't want to try to make eliquid myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwaione Posted May 14, 2012 Author Share Posted May 14, 2012 i can still vape and they said nothing about it... I think the blood pressure is unrelated and is more of an anxiety issue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted May 14, 2012 Share Posted May 14, 2012 Lucky for you that you had a tolerance built up. A non-smoker, a child or a pet would have been face down much quicker and no chance of ever getting up. That's my biggest concern, my kids and my cat. My kids are old enough to understand and I remind them all the time not to touch my stuff and why. My base liquids that are somewhat high in nicotine are locked away now but even vapable strength juice is enough to get someone very sick. Everyone needs to be aware of this. I don't want bottled juice to get a bad rap and I certainly don't want to read about a child drinking it so everyone needs to keep this in mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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