DoctorJ

Not exactly sure what point it is that I'm missing or how I'm misguided (and I'm not asking for an explanation either ). Just pointing out there is some hope for the industry. Guess my optimism is just me, seems that most have doomed the industry. Sorry to try and break up the pity party for the demise of vaping. My bad.

After reading the regs closely, I'm not too worried at this point. We will have all of the vaping equipment at our disposal that is out now and what comes out before 8/8. I do want to be prepared, but not at this juncture to the point of having massive amounts of vaping equipment and supplies taking up a whole room! I'm with whoever said "let's wait and see". The regs are a "final deeming" yes, however, if you read closely the FDA states that there could be changes as they gain information and more knowledge on the subject. IMO, there might be a bit less of the vaping supplies out there once the 2 year period is over, however, this might be a good thing as far as more reliable and safer equipment and supplies. We will probably be paying a bit more I'm sure as ciggarette smokers did once the government starting piling on the "sin taxes". I remember cigs being .45 a pack when I started smoking back in 1976 and now they are $4 a pack (for the brand I smoked and where I live, I know they are much more expensive in other areas). We may have to rely on B&M's much more than we do now. I recently spoke with a local shop owner and he said that equipment will more than likely be a bit more expensive, however, it wouldn't affect him as much since he doesn't make his own juice and is strictly a retailer. We may also see a big decline in online sales due to ID restrictions, but I'm sure the industry will address that issue and hopefully it won't make as big of an impact to the online vendors. At this point in time, I believe we are going to be OK for the next 2 years, I hope. But as I said, after reading the regs, I don't think the "vape apocalypse" is upon us, nor will it come to that point. But I've been known to be wrong, once or twice a decade... , and I hope this isn't one of the times. Should it appear that we are in trouble, I'll be maxing out my credit cards and the post office will get to know me very well, even more so than they do now!

I sat down and read the FDA regs the other day and it took quite a bit of reading, a good 3-4 hours. The document is 499 pages, however, the last 50 pages or so are references, definitions and laws that were referred to in the whole document. Around 100 or so of the pages directly refer to e cigs and maybe 50 are related to e cigs as it pertains to nicotine warnings, underage sales and packaging. Some of the regulations I found quite humorous, such as regulating screwdrivers and lanyards because they are considered to be used directly with e cigs and the FDA has found them to be in the class of "tobacco products". So The Home Depot is gonna need FDA approval to sell screwdrivers? And I guess all of my colleagues will need FDA approval for the lanyards with our ID's that we are required to wear while on campus. I was wondering what the sports coaches are going to do about their whistles? I know they are referring to items that come with tanks or kits, but it doesn't really specify that in the document. I agree that a good part of the regs are a bit restrictive, however, so many vaping groups are screaming PROHIBITION when if you read closely, this is regulation. The FDA clearly states in the document they are not looking to ban e cigs: "(Comment 161) Many comments expressed concern that Congress did not wish to effectively ban e-cigarettes (as they claimed would occur as a result of deeming these products), because such a ban violates section 907(d)(3) of the FD&C Act. They stated that if Congress wanted to ban them, they would have done so under their drug authority. (Response) FDA is not banning any category of tobacco product by issuing this final deeming rule." The FDA recognizes that there may be possible health benefits to e cigs: "(Comment 141) Many comments stated, but did not provide supporting data, that ecigarettes: (1) Are approximately 99 percent less hazardous than cigarettes; (2) are only consumed by smokers and former smokers who quit by switching to e-cigarettes; and (3) have not been found to create nicotine dependence in any nonsmoker. They also stated that there is no evidence that ingesting e-liquid leads to fatalities. (Response) As discussed throughout this document, FDA agrees that use of ENDS is likely less hazardous for an individual user than continued smoking of traditional cigarettes." " Until the FDA publishes a final guidance for each product category and to provide ENDS manufacturers a lengthier compliance period based on where they purport to fit within the risk continuum for nicotine-delivering products (e.g., Comment No. FDA-2014-N-0189-81859; Comment No. FDA-2014-N-0189-10852). In response to these comments, we note that nicotine use in any form is of particular concern for youth and pregnant women. On the other hand, some evidence suggests that ENDS may potentially promote transition away from combusted tobacco use among some current users and it is possible that there could be a public health benefit." While it may seem that the FDA is coming down hard on vapers, if you read closely there are comments that suggest they are trying to help product manufacturers by way of offering guidance to get products approved. Instead of trying to address all of the possible passages that are "good news", I've made a list highlighting passages that we vapers can look at and possibly see that these regs aren't as bad as they seem. The FDA even states in a few places that they will take new information into consideration while drafting the "be all-end all" rules that will be in effect once it's all said and done. All of these passages in the attachment are taken directly from the document and while some passages are not "whole", meaning I've taken a lot of the legal speak out to highlight the main point of the passage, they remain in context with the spirit of the passage itself. You can take these for what they are worth. There is no reading between the lines here, nor are there any of my opinions inserted in the passages. They are cut and pasted directly from the document as they appear within. If you believe that the government is out to kill vaping and the vaping industry, so is your right to think so. Personally I don't see any conspiracy or prohibition in this document, such is my opinion. I'm merely trying to point out some of the positive aspects of this document, as restrictive as it may seem, to show that there is a light at the end of the tunnel. And no, it is not a train coming in your direction FDA regs.doc

Decided to close my account on the other forum and move over here. I've been registered here for a few years, however, things just got too serious on the other. After reading a few of the posts on some of the threads, it seems you guys are a bit more kicked back and don't take yourselves so seriously and also appreciate some optimism.

Understood! That's why I referenced ECF. Members could check me out over there and see I've been around for a bit.Check the PIF section It won't let me start a new topic in the buying selling thread, says I can't. That's why i asked about a verification process or something.

Hello all. Not a noob vaper here, been vaping for 7 months now. Also been active on the ECF forum under same name. Thought I'd expand my horizons to other forums. One question to start, is there a minimum number of posts or some sort of qualifications to post on the buying/selling threads? A verification process perhaps? Thanks in advance for any info!